Thought you might have found this interesting. #Pretty much what everyone already believed.
Taken from the Townsville Bulletin 08/02/06
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It's official, fish do not feel pain
By DANIEL BATEMAN
08feb06
DO we have sensitive new-age fish in our waterways?
No, is the answer from three scientists on the subject of whether fish have more than just hurt feelings when we hook them.
A letter to the editor published in Monday's Townsville Bulletin called for an end to the barramundi season because fish feel fear and pain just as we and our pet dogs do and therefore was 'akin to impaling puppies or ponies on hooks'.
But James Cook University fisheries biologist Dr Dean Jerry said the short answer was no, the pain response of fish and mammals was too different to suggest barramundi were being tortured.
"The general consensus is that the pain pathways in fish are a lot different to mammals," Dr Jerry said.
"They generally do not feel the same amount of pain as we do."
In her letter, Bulletin reader Rebecca Smith said 'most recent and credible scientific literature shows fish, barramundi included, have the same nerve endings, the same chemicals for transmitting and blocking pain, and the same receptor sites for anxiety-reducing chemicals as mammals'.
But Dr Jerry said recent scientific literature does not reflect this at all.
"I don't agree that the literature actually says that," he said.
"The current belief is you cannot put human feeling into anything as low down the evolutionary ladder as a fish."
Dr Walter Starck, a retired marine biologist of 50 years' experience worldwide, said it was a difficult question to answer.
"These kind of claims are like whether or not you believe in creationism or evolutionism," Dr Starck said.
"There is no way to prove either.
"I've caught fish and released them a few minutes later, only to find them return and take the same bait again."
He said the inherent flaw with Ms Smith's claims was there was a fundamental difference between the brains of fish and mammals.
"There is a huge difference between the brain of a fish and the brain of a human and a brain of a dog," Dr Starck said.
"The brain is where the pain signals are processed and where they are experienced, not the peripheral nervous system.
"Even if there was a peripheral nervous system then yes, there is a response from a painful process, but there would not be a consciousness associated with the brain to experience that pain."
Marine biologist and fisherman Andrew Tobin said the discomfort a fish may feel when caught was far removed from what humans perceive as pain.
"There is no doubt fish feel some discomfort," Mr Tobin said.
"They certainly are trying to get away.
"But whether they experience what we perceive as pain is pretty farfetched."
Sunfish NQ spokesman Arthur Dobe said the idea of doing away with recreational fishing of barramundi because the fish feel pain was 'ridiculous'.
"Fish have instinct, not pain," Mr Dobe said.
"Where will it stop? In Holland or Germany there is hardly any more primary industry because of all this green business and liberation business."
Southwind SF20 'Piscatoreous'
Savage 14ft tinny "About Time'
Will it convince the greenies? Will it buggery? They'll bash us for bashing's sake.
Please ensure that you anaesthetise all pipis prior to cooking............haven't you seen them open their little shells to scream?And what about all those poor little plankton getting bashed to death by sinkers?
kev
Vital documents will demonstrate their vitality by spontaneously moving from where you left them to where you can't find them.
And the jellyfish that go through my propeller
Last weekend I watched as a large school of mullet was being chased by something.
They were fleeing in panic , jumping out of the water to get away.
Suddenly a metre long wahoo comes spearing out of the depths , mouth full of razor sharps....
Question for the greenies? Is it MORE or LESS stressful for the fish to be constantly pursued by big toothy critters than being hooked by a fisherman.
In the ocean its dog eat dog .
Im just a different dog when i go fishing.
If I wasnt fishing would the fish be less stressed??? (B#++$#!t)
I've seen plenty of underwater footage of fish after they have been hooke. They appear to want to escape, and appear otherwise OK and calm.
Pain in humans or other land mammals, alters the way they respond because the pain signals are interfeing with the instruction to the muscles.
But Kev's right, how do you convince the whacko's from Animal Liberation???
Im with you Rando dont reckon no shark is going to ask me if I feel pain next time I go spearing
predators inflict pain on prey - nature is cruel - however even in humans pain is overridden in the violent moments of trauma by adrenaline & its lymphatic mates.
We associated a lingering wound that causes us conscious pain with the moment of trauma that caused it - this requires a CEREBRAL CORTEX or Frontal Lobe the bit right under the forehead. We have this in addition to the brain bits fish & lizards etc have - a survival (reactive) brain.
The greatest folly of many in the green movement will be to place humans above the web of life rather than to educate them to be conscious of their place in it. There's too many wannabe greens who for some reason can't be bothered to study biology & ecology properly.
chris
I've actually seen a study on TV that indicated that plants can "feel pain" and respond to events in their surroundings.
So we better start liking soylent green, coz we're running out of options
cheers,
Owen
Cheers,
Owen
The whole world's mad save thee & me (but I'm not too sure about thee)
Of course fish feel pain. Just their primitive brain doesn't let that stop them trying to survive and keep feeding. I think its more a question of how the animal reacts to pain rather than a definitive answer to the question of pain perception by the fish. Unlike humans, when a little fishie feels pain, the family doesn't put them to bed and bring them a cup of tea and an aspirin. Trying to compare reactions to pain between species as far apart as dogs, people and fish is bound to lay the question open to interpretation.
The poor old fishies have a high mortality rate from birth and nature just doesn't support wimpish fish who loose the will to survive when hurt. I have caught some big bream with serious scars on their bodies where a predator has obviously taken a chunk out when they were younger. I have also caught fish with two or three hooks in their mouth. That doesn't prove that the hooks dont hurt the fish, it just proves that the will to survive is stronger.
People all around the world in countries less lucky than ours continue to survive despite serious illness, injury and pain. It doesn't mean they don't feel pain the same way we do, it just means they want to go on living and will push through the pain in order to do whatever it takes to survive.
The old argument that fish dont feel pain is just a cop out. I am not a greenie, but I am not a hypocrite either. I know that when I put a livie on a hook I want it to swim like a hurt baitfish.
I have had a few dogs that were to stupid to feel pain
We play kick the puppy with the rat dog she loves it.
---------------Originally Posted by Dug
I have had a few dogs that were to stupid to feel pain
We play kick the puppy with the rat dog she loves it.
Had a girlfriend like that once.
She must be 50 now. Wonder whatever happened to her?
i got in a punch up with my goldfish, he said i not only hurt him, but his feelings too when i won.
I am a wee bit of a hippy when it comes to things of a spiritual nature (not that we need to discuss it) however I believe and have taught my children that, it is wrong to kill for pleasure and I would never do this. However if the living thing has a purpose be it bait or food it is fair game.
Therefore it is interesting to find out the facts, does a fish feel pain or not? however the outcome has no bearing on our choice to fish because the only fish that get kept in our house are for a purpose.
And besides I LOVE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Al, I have used this illustration before but I know of several incidents whilst in the tropical fish industry, of large cichlids such as Oscars and Red Devils falling asleep on the aquarium heater and burning themselves. I think that's pretty conclusive that they don't feel pain.
kev
Dear God,
So far today,
I've done all right.
I haven't gossiped.
I haven't lost my temper.
I haven't been greedy, grumpy,
nasty, selfish or overindulgent.
I'm very thankful for that.
But in a few minutes, God,
I'm going to get out of bed;
and from then on, I'm probably
going to need a lot more help.
And further to that pray here is mine,
Dear god,
I pray for wisdom to understand my man;
Love to forgive him;
And patients for his moods;
Because Lord, if I pray strength,
I WILL BET HIM TO DEATH.
Amen
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