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Thread: World Known Scientist Speaks Out On Green Zones

  1. #1
    Derek_Bullock
    Guest

    World Known Scientist Speaks Out On Green Zones

    World Renown Scientist Dr Walter Starck PHD.

    “Expansion of green Zones is a political cheap shot.”


    Dr Walter Starck said today, “The proposed expansion of green zones on the GBR is a hypothetical solution to an imaginary problem. Over 90% of the GBR is already a green zone in that it is rarely visited and fishing pressure is so low as to be effectively non-existent. The claim of over fishing is not simply an overstatement it’s absurd. The total commercial and recreational catch only comes to some 6000 tonns/year or an average of about 17 Kg/Km². This is less than 1% of the yield of beef from good grazing land or of what reefs elsewhere can and do sustain. Extensive and expensive underwater surveys of coral trout populations funded by GBRMPA show no evidence of depletion. Why have these not been published?”

    He also stated “Green zones are appropriate where fishing pressure is intense enough to significantly reduce breeding populations. Where fewer juvenile recruits are available than an area will sustain a protected breeding stock can make a significant difference. However, where fishing pressure is low, as on the GBR, reproductive capacity of breeding stocks far exceeds suitable habitat available for new recruits. Increasing this excess capacity by some small amount is meaningless. All that more green zones here can achieve is to increase fishing pressure on the open reefs.”

    Dr Starck said, “Expansion of green zones is a political cheap shot.” “ It’s easy, attracts attention, saving the reef is always popular, and with no real problem to begin with everything is in place for it to be declared another shining example of successful reef management. They might as well be managing the moon.”

    [hr]
    Great Barrier Reef threatened: so where is the evidence?

    By Walter Starck


    Over the past four decades, not a year has passed without news reports of dire threats to the Great Barrier Reef. Some have been new threats, others old ones, refurbished or just reiterated. Typically the source is presented as an “expert”. None of these prophesies of doom have materialised and the GBR has remained a vast and essentially pristine natural region. Of the nearly 3,000 reefs in the GBR complex, only a few dozen are regularly visited, and even these have relatively sparse usage with detectable human effects being rare or trivial.

    Not a single one of the thousands of species of reef creatures has been exterminated since European settlement. Not one is endangered. The commercial and recreational fishing harvest is less than 1 per cent of the rate sustained by a broad range of reefs elsewhere. No harmful level of toxins, nutrients or other chemical pollutants has been detected on the reef. Although claims are made of increased sedimentation due to human activity, the evidence for this is indirect and uncertain. In any case such evidence is restricted to near-shore waters and even then there is no indication of increased turbidity between the uninhabited Cape York region and the more populated regions to the south.

    The big problem for truth and reality in this regard is that the reef is inaccessible, it is underwater and it is vast. Anyone can claim anything and who’s to know differently?

  2. #2

    Re: World Known Scientist Speaks Out On Green Zone

    "Not a single one of the thousands of species of reef creatures has been exterminated since European settlement. Not one is endangered. The commercial and recreational fishing harvest is less than 1 per cent of the rate sustained by a broad range of reefs elsewhere. No harmful level of toxins, nutrients or other chemical pollutants has been detected on the reef. Although claims are made of increased sedimentation due to human activity, the evidence for this is indirect and uncertain. In any case such evidence is restricted to near-shore waters and even then there is no indication of increased turbidity between the uninhabited Cape York region and the more populated regions to the south.

    The big problem for truth and reality in this regard is that the reef is inaccessible, it is underwater and it is vast. Anyone can claim anything and who’s to know differently? "


    wow..that last sentence sure shoots down his argument and anyone elses.

  3. #3

    Re: World Known Scientist Speaks Out On Green Zone

    Pinhead

    Not really

    Those who do not take the time to listen to both sides of the argument will not know the difference. The real problem is that bodies like GBRMPA gain funding for research into problems. If no problem exists no funding will be gained. It leads to a bias where bad news is spread and good news gets buried.

    Ask GBRMPA why they made no mention of AIMS reports during the RAP process and why they used examples of overseas fisheries and fish to 'scare' the public into believing the reef is 'under pressure'

    Why did they state they have proof over fishing damages coral reefs while not saying it is over fishing of herbivorous fish (seaweed eaters which are not targeted by Queenslanders) not fish like coral trout or red-throat.

    Why do they (not GBRMPA this time) bring in spawning closures on reef fish when the science says some 80% of coral trout they studied did not attend any known spawning aggregation, AND line fisheries exist in Australia that are based on targetting spawning closures and have been proven sustainable.

    Bad news gets publicity, good news gets buried and the general public knows no different.

    "who’s to know differently" unless they listen to both sides and make up their own minds. Thats one of the reasons TFPQ was formed - to try and have the other side of the argument heard.

  4. #4

    Re: World Known Scientist Speaks Out On Green Zone

    wot can i say wow sum reccos starting to see thru the myths and lies fostered by the green movement hell bent on stopping any use of public resources other than to their single minded and distorted views. thanxs guys for posting articles suggestive alternatives to the green hysteria

  5. #5

    Re: World Known Scientist Speaks Out On Green Zone

    Sorry guys, just re-read my post. Line fisheries exist targetting spawning aggregations, NOT closures. Heaven forbid anyone targetting closures. Don't even think about that.

  6. #6

    Re: World Known Scientist Speaks Out On Green Zone

    wrong nulla..it is not about both sides of the story...if it is science based there is only one side of the story...the facts...the Dr stated the reef is inaccessible therefore no one really has the facts.

  7. #7

    Re: World Known Scientist Speaks Out On Green Zone

    Interesting point PinHead.

    The problem is not the 'fact' it is the interpretation of the fact and the conclusion drawn.

    eg Coral Trout attend spawning aggregations. FACT
    IF fishermen knew where every spawning aggregation was, and could catch every fish at every spawning aggregation there would soon be no fish left. INTERPRETATION
    We MUST ban fishing during times of spawning agregation CONCLUSION

    The problem is what about the known but untold fact that only a small percentage of fish actually attend agregations.

    What about the untold fact that research shows that commercial fishers do not bias their trips around times of agregations, almost all their trips are driven by weather. Are rec fishers any different?

    What about the fact that sustainable fisheries exist based on targeting spawning agregations

    The reef is inaccessible FACT. Sort of but not really. It is practically inaccessible to rec users most of the time. With todays technology no part of the reef, including the centre of large coral bommies (drilling technology) is truly 'inaccessible'.

    It is all about which 'facts' are presented and how you interpret 'facts' and how many votes are in it for the politician making the decision.

    'If it is science based there is only one side of the story', tell that to climate change scientists who don't believe in the current 'global warming story', and there are many of them. That is the real problem, in the seventies it was global cooling and we were headed for an ice age. It must have been so because science told us it was a fact.

  8. #8
    BAIT_MAN
    Guest

    Re: World Known Scientist Speaks Out On Green Zone

    Quote Originally Posted by nulla
    eg Coral Trout attend spawning aggregations. FACT
    IF fishermen knew where every spawning aggregation was, and could catch every fish at every spawning aggregation there would soon be no fish left. INTERPRETATION
    We MUST ban fishing during times of spawning agregation CONCLUSION
    Nulla
    I would agree with your first two statements but not the third. Would it not be better that we put in place a regalation that states during any spawning aggregation the fish that is spawing must be released. I say this this because as a fisherman i dont want to be baned from catching fish in a area because of the spawning aggregation. I personaly agree that all fish that we catch that we know are spawing should be released. This would inculded bream, flathead, whiting, mullet. This would have to apply to everyone not just the few.

    Shane

  9. #9

    Re: World Known Scientist Speaks Out On Green Zone

    I personaly agree that all fish that we catch that we know are spawning should be released. This would include bream, flathead, whiting, mullet.
    Maaaaaaate ,
    TOTALLY disagree with you......sorry , but call it angler-feedback > >

    imo......DO NOT confuse some 'experiment' to basically protect the very lucrative commercial Coral Trout ,as applying to general bread 'n butter species.

    Most "good-fishing times" are, in fact around spawning time.....

    i'll offer half-a-carrot ,and say that netting of near-entire schools of some species , at spawning time, should be looked at.

    BOTTOMLINE....bag & size restrict fishing, not some feel-good experiment on coral trout spawning , that needs adjusting or abandonment.

  10. #10

    Re: World Known Scientist Speaks Out On Green Zone

    Shane

    Sorry mate. The example I gave was meant to be one of how you could come to bad decisions based on interpretation of 'facts'.

    I don't think there should be a ban on all fishing during the coral reef fin fish spawning closure. Having said that however, the case for the barra spawning closure is somwhat different (more defined, single species, more easily targetted). How many people know where coral reef fin fish aggregate to spawn?

    Reef finfish spawning does not seem to correlate exactly with the times of the closures (anecdotal evidence from commercial fishers).

    To my way of thinking bag and size limits are the real story. Whether you catch the fish today, tomorrow or yesterday, you still ctach the fish. Size limits are supposed to mean that legal size fish have all spwned at least once. If the catch is sustainable, what is the worry?

    Iagree with you and don't agree with the third statement in my previous post either. Releasing roed fish has merit, but is there a NEED to release the fish and will it survive anyway are more important issues.

  11. #11
    BAIT_MAN
    Guest

    Re: World Known Scientist Speaks Out On Green Zone

    Quote Originally Posted by Gazza
    I personaly agree that all fish that we catch that we know are spawning should be released. This would include bream, flathead, whiting, mullet.
    Most "good-fishing times" are, in fact around spawning time.....
    Gazza
    i agree with you on this issue BUT if for example you take two roed up female and two roed up male snapper and not allow them to spawn how many less snapper would there be. If you put them back and allow them to spawn over a period of time 2+ years the snapper have to increase in numbers which has to be good for every one. Just look at what has happen to the snapper now that the size limit is 35cm the fish have had a better chance to grow.

    [quote=Gazza]
    i'll offer half-a-carrot ,and say that netting of near-entire schools of some species , at spawning time, should be looked at.
    Clearly some forms of commercial fishing, while economically important, have a devastating impact on seabed communities as well as beaches and should be phased out but, at the same time, well managed, low impact commercial fisheries should also have continued access to the fishing grounds.

  12. #12

    minsizelimit

    Just look at what has happen to the snapper now that the size limit is 35cm the fish have had a better chance to grow.
    Mate ,we're singing off the same sheet of music .....SIZE limit

    e.g. duskie...40 ~70 , 5bag ,maybe oneday...36~75cms??? i.e. because they're SAVED
    e.g. near-future...tailor 40cms...prefer 34/35cms jmo

    Bumline ...no problems with a minsize being RELATED to one or 2 previous spawns.

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