Snapper Wild Stocking......... it's viable

[Dignity]

Noelm, your little estuary is probably one of the few places left where they still live. Phill mentioned 'destruction of habitat' as being a cause, this certainly has happened all up and down the coast. We had a local shopping centre expand and originally the new section which included mangroves on the creek was to be retained. But surprisingly, not, as the building progressed the developer did a deal and replaced them with new growth at a location that I haven't been able to ascertain. This happens all the time yet govts seem to forget that over 90% of fish fry live their first stages in mangroves and estuaries, even the marlin start their early life there.

[gazza2006au]

How would a recreational angler know if they caught a wild stocked Kingie ? The system of breeding and releasing stocks utilises a chemical dye in the food that can only be traced if the fish that has been caught is returned to the " lab " for analysis .

The question of viability comes down to importance and votes. There is no doubt it is important, maybe even vital to sustain our fisheries, but would a sitting Govt spend a couple of mill on fingerlings or a new park / school / road / etc etc

The question of viability is also heavily linked to priorities. If you took a petition to the Fisheries Minister that had 250,000 signatures on it, you'd have wild stocking locked in the following week. Unfortunately it works this way

WE know the recruitment rate in the wild is under 5% and the science tells us recruitment of released ( wild stocked ) fish would be about 1%. 1% of say 20 million is still a huge impact in say Moreton Bay. Those figures are not out of reach as each mature Snapper can produce up to 3 million eggs per breeding season... extrapolate that !! ><>

I'm just saying the Snapper fishery is not sustainable here in Qld and needs a hand. The hand being given currently is not working. Habitat rehabilitation, wild stocking and by-catch reduction are the only things not addressed in current management programs.

LP

Hey LP i think from memory they released 60,000 or 70,000 king fish the way u cal tell none of those released have been caught because the king fish that everyone catch are 45-55cm none are under 30cm not even close to 30cm i think the fingerlings were tiny

[Lucky_Phill]

Thanks so far to all for their thoughts and input.

This subject has been going on for many years and as a part of it, I sat with FQ scientists ( a number of different ones ) and talked about all things relating to Snapper, from how do they get the bump, to by-catch, to habitat, to mass spawning events, juvenile nurseries to adult aggregations, growth rates, wild mortality rates, migration between bays and open oceans. Some of these guys have well over 20 years of data both factual and anecdotal.

The Maroochy River stocking program ( whiting ) was a one off event that didn't seem to show great results............ one off's do not work. !

Questions still need to be asked like " are we flogging a dead horse " ? maybe climate change is having an effect we cannot overcome ?

Do we really know the cause of severely declining stocks and what demographic are those stocks ( large adults, adolescents, juveniles, ) ??? Is a large sector of this fishery moving to deeper, colder waters ???

There are so many factors to look at with some, more important than others. I could go on for hours with data, scenarios, anecdotal evidence and theories, but I digress.

I suppose I just get frustrated when FQ announce a management program for a fishery and all that entails is a size increase or bag limit reduction or closed season........ it just seems to narrow visioned, it's like putting a band-aid on a melanoma, yes, you may cover it, but you ain't fixing the problem.

There is no disputing the facts here in Qld, that the " smooth waters " ( close to shore ) have suffered the most. Land degradation, destruction of habitat, over fishing, illegal fishing, water temps and by-catch issues are the contributing factors to our current situation.

There are ways to address most of those issues, but dropping an artificial reef near Peel Island will not get a pollie enough votes to win a seat. We are still lacking a strong stakeholder group to sit on all working groups dedicated to Queenslands Fishery.

Sunfish have been doing their best to contribute commonsense debates and proposals.

Recreational Anglers must also play their part and contribute data.

LP

[gazza2006au]

I think the biggest thing is food these fish go from eating pellets to have to hunt down live living fish to eat than there is another fish on its tail trying to do the same

Its a fish eat fish world

I really hope the snapper do take off it would be good to get a few in sydney that are bigger than 15cm

[chris69]

Phil the trawlers have been reduced in the bay for many years now and theres no increase in catches which I thought would happen more prawns more fish but that has not happened but the rec side of things has exploded and lots of land cleared to house the population increase something is not working anymore were not even getting the tuna in the bay like we used to were catching more runoff to fill the dams so there water for all the extra people crossing the boarder,i think it won't matter how many fingerlings are tipped in the bay its not firing in the seasons like it used too, we don't even get the jellyfish as much anymore.

[Dignity]

Phil the trawlers have been reduced in the bay for many years now and theres no increase in catches which I thought would happen more prawns more fish but that has not happened but the rec side of things has exploded and lots of land cleared to house the population increase something is not working anymore were not even getting the tuna in the bay like we used to were catching more runoff to fill the dams so there water for all the extra people crossing the boarder,i think it won't matter how many fingerlings are tipped in the bay its not firing in the seasons like it used too, we don't even get the jellyfish as much anymore.

Once again, a lot comes down to the environment, destruction of mangroves is a disaster. Recently with the help of the local indigenous community who supplied mangrove trees to 1 metre plus in height and that takes quote an effort , the SSC council and the local Onslow cadets an area was planted out. However several months later nearly everyone had been vandalised. The thought is residents not wanting to lose their water views.
Hopefully it was a one off but that is still just one very small part of the equation as Phill states.

[gazza2006au]

Chris have u compared local water temps to say 5 years ago or maybeven 20 years? It may be global warming it couldausfish be the water in your bay may have risen there arelots of contributors tho the more global warming the more rain flushing out rivers and bays etc with fresh

Down here we are seeing makos along our shores which i have never heard of before one guy caught a mako under the gladesville bridge in the river several months ago, these are usually sharksthat are 20kms out to sea

[Lucky_Phill]

I have sent an email to most of the people that responded here.

If you have not received one from me, 3 things have happened.

1... You have changed your email address that you signed on with Ausfish originally

2... It has gone to your junk mail

3.. You've read it and have not or am not going to respond.

Either way, if you haven't got this email, please message me or post here and I will get it to you. I believe it is important and concerns the survival of the Snapper Fishery.


Cheers LP

[Dignity]

I have sent an email to most of the people that responded here.

If you have not received one from me, 3 things have happened.

1... You have changed your email address that you signed on with Ausfish originally

2... It has gone to your junk mail

3.. You've read it and have not or am not going to respond.

Either way, if you haven't got this email, please message me or post here and I will get it to you. I believe it is important and concerns the survival of the Snapper Fishery.


Cheers LP

Didn't get one Phill, PM sent.

[Bremic]

Hi Phil

You could forward an email to me, please.

[Lucky_Phill]

Hi Phil

You could forward an email to me, please.

Done.....

[tunaticer]

I don't think that wild stocking snapper will be a success until the minimum size limit is stepped up to 50cm fork length....I mean fair suck, the fish can grow to a metre long! Currently the minimum size is still a juvenile....wake up Australia!

[Lucky_Phill]

I don't think that wild stocking snapper will be a success until the minimum size limit is stepped up to 50cm fork length....I mean fair suck, the fish can grow to a metre long! Currently the minimum size is still a juvenile....wake up Australia!

The current size limit in Qld is based on them having at least 2 spawning seasons.

LP

[Ronje1]

" we do not know the recreational take ( or bio mass ), so we have to make an educated guess."


There's gear around now that WILL measure biomass of a number of different species. Its main use is in rivers and dams (confined areas). Biosonics equipment and its based in Qld. Have seen it in operation and the results. Pretty impressive stuff.

Also used for determining tilapia infestation along with trout biomass measurements in NSW. Also does bathymetric surveys of rivers and dams.

Via "machine learning", it will display location and size/number tag nominated species once its been taught what to look for. Currently does usual freshwater surveys for different freshwater species.

In saltwater, I saw a result of measuring numbers of king threadfin along with sizes along a section of bank in peak king season in Fitzroy. 1 km of bank yielded 5,000 individual king.

Only way that could be used for snapper would be to "teach" it to look for snapper and then sample a nominated area over a period. There'd be no benchmarked starting point though.

All Qld Fisheries has as a starting point is catch boat ramp data from rec fishermen and commercial log books.

Qld Fisheries have a current policy of NOT stocking saltwater with ANY species (even barramundi) so there'd have to be a policy change there which is a lengthy and convoluted process. I'd be hopeful rather than confident that'll happen though.

Qld Fisheries is dead against the use of Biosonics equipment mainly because the owner of the company is not on their christmas card list.

However, NSW Fisheries love it. Councils and dam operators in Qld also use the service. But not Qld Fisheries.

Good luck with it.

[Lucky_Phill]

Are you saying Fisheries Queensland will not advance our fishery because of politics ?