bilge set up

[blacklab]

LOL, you've gotta hate that..
I had a similar experience, we were at the shelf off Eden, trolling and we had previously been going for kingies just out of two fold bay before we headed out. The live bait tank was a huge thing, home made by previous owner, so we filled it up, loaded it with live bait, no joy on kingies so we headed out to the shelf. I was busy rigging lines, decky was driving, got out here and turned back and the live bait tank had emptied itself, keeped filling up and emptying itself for a good hour, the bilge was full, it was over the floor at the back ( manual pump ), it was a rough as guts and in all honesty wasn't a big issue but panick set in, The pump went on, I could get a bucket easy enough in the bilge area easy enough, turned of the live bait pump as the bait tank was kept full, soon got it under control, but had the heart pumping. when I removed the old live bait tank, I filled it and measured it's volume, it held over 100 litres, so the weight of that plus the fact it kept filling ! It was my decky's first ever trip out wide, he seriously went green LOL.
Yes the existing hole is helm side, just under the gunnel rubber, so that's ideal and I have enough room to go for a larger pump no problem at all, so I will do that I think, they were advertising a 2000 GPH model, so I will exchange the 1100 one for a 2000.
Thanks Scott appreciated.......

Col

[ranmar850]

Just a best practice question,
Installing bilge pump and float switch in the bottom of the bilge. I would prefer to stay away from fibre glassing a patch down at this stage, So I was
thinking of cutting a piece of flat aluminium to the base size of the pump and float switch, marine Urethaning the flat aluminium piece down to the bilge floor
then screwing the bilge and float switch to the flat aluminium, ?? comments.
Also, I was just measuring the height for the hose above the actual pump, I understand the higher you go, the less efficient the pump becomes. The engine well above if I put the outlet there, would probably be around 450-500 mm. However, I have found a hole, I always new it was there, underneath the gunnel rubber, which has been filled up ( previous owner ), which got me thinking, height from pump would be approx 650mm and it would be a bigger distance, but there would be less bends and I could secure the hose up higher on the inside of the transom out of the way, I think. the existing hole must have been for some type of water escape, currently its only about 18mm, so I realise I would have to enlarge it. currently I have an 1100 rule pump and all fittings including wiring pipes and control switch on hold, I could increase the size of the pump on the order.
Thoughts ?

Col

I struck this with my first f/glass boat. very old school, original owner, had a sumlog ( ) not working, of course, no GPS, much of the wiring stuffed, etc. No electric bilge pump. This was the older style ( better, IMO, ) where the lower deck was sealed from the upper with its own drain, and a pocket at the back for draining to the bung. Perfect place to fit an electric pump. But I didn't want to drill into the hull. So I cleaned up the flocoat with acetone, and roughed up the underside of the red plastic pump base, as well as drilling some extra 10mm holes in it. Put a generous pad of Sikaflex down, and pushed the base onto the sikaflex. This caused the sika to mushroom up through the holes, and I just pushed them down low enough to not interfere with the impeller. So it was well stuck, with no drilling.

[ranmar850]

I've been wrestiling with the whole redundancy thing for bilge pumps with my current boat. It has one of those Rule 1100GPH auto pumps, fitted due to real space constraints down the back. The hull arrangement is just one big underdeck area, everything drains through the back of the vee, 32mm bung. Almost impossible to reach over the back, unless you get in the water. Even if I mount one up a bit, still a real struggle, and it will only be an emergency thing. And you would still need to do another skin fitting for discharge.
I actually had a problem just yesterday, came in after a long rather shitty day, drained it on the ramp slope, and got about 20 litres out. Looked like the pump wasn't working on auto. Looked at it today, a terminal under the dash had disconnected, pump was manual only. That was easily fixed, but I'm just not happy with relying on a single pump. I'm used to having a boat with both electric and motor-driven options, as well as the hand pump. Or something where you can reach over easily to pull the bung and plane it out.
So I reckon i will just carry an emergency electric. Get a 4000 gph Rule, put 2 metres of hose on it, and wire to an Anderson plug. I have two easy to reach Andersen plug outlets, 3 if you count the fridge. So, if I really need to shift water, I can just jam it down the back, plug in, and pump. Sure, it probably adds another 2kg of weight, sitting in the copious spare space under the seats in the cuddy, but worth it for peace of mind. I'm doing an extended trip out to the Montebello Islands in May, and it's one thing I can tick off the list of worries.

[stevej]

20 l probably wasnt enough to trigger the float

[ranmar850]

It should have been enough, I think, but even when the whole thing was submerged, it still wasn't working, culprit was a connection on the back of the switch that had been knocked off. On the plane, 20 litres would be deep enough down in the vee to trigger it.

[Sore arms]

If you have the space and or wallet for it two full size pumps with standalone float switches and manual overrides would give you the best redundancy.
Just pull alternate fuses/CB's on every second trip and you could effectively double the lifespan of the pumps while keeping both systems operating regularly.

The biggest problem is as soon as you start to open the can of redundancy worms things tend to get out of hand and complex/expensive surprisingly quickly.

If all else fails and depending on where your leak is coming from get it up on plane and pull out a couple of bungs.

Just my 02c

Alex.

[blairv70]

I have 2 pumps set at different heights but not by much. I have dual batteries and wire one pump fully to each battery in a non switched manner so if 1 x battery fails I still have 1 pump working. The main pump also has a manual button on the dash and the secondary pump has a test button at the transom but it is supposed to be automatic in normal mode. A little paranoid but I do this for double safety and also to ensure I can test each pump.

I think the most important point though is to test at least once a year and also to inspect the filters to ensure there are no blockages. For me it is lifting the floor and crawling into some tight spaces but at least it is piece of mind.

A couple of years ago I had the drain from the anchor well (skin fitting) snap off in some rough weather and would have not known anything until the boat was full of water - luckily the pumps kicked in and all was ok.

Bilge pumps are not set and forget

[scottar]

Most definitely not set and forget. I check mine when I pack the boat before every trip with a flick of the float switch. At work bilge alarms are checked every month at a minimum.

[blacklab]

Well, It's been near two weeks, I've managed to get a 10 day holiday in, caught a nice Mulloway, returned back to work and still damn well waiting
For some of my parts to be shipped to me for my Bilge set up. Normally, I get good service through the post, but Geez, not this time.
Have my new Gunwale rubber on order as well, need to get a piece of that, to find my clearance for my outlet skin fitting on the side of the boat, before pulling out the hole saw, kinda only want to drill that once, with no after job fibre glass patching.
1 more day before another weekend arrives, Geez, it would be nice to get a surprise in the post tomorrow so I can get cracking with it.
OK, my Bitchin is over.....

Col

[blacklab]

Couldn't wait for the new gunwale rubber to arrive, so used a piece of the old gunwale rubber to check my clearance underneath it for my out pipe.
I'm hoping the new rubber is the same width, as I drilled a 38mm hole thru the hull this arvo !.
Not sure whether i'm liking these plastic through hull fittings, found a place on line that sells them in Stainless, I'd much rather fit a stainless one, I figure it will last longer and would be better to seal to metal than those plastic parts.
The rule pump that I purchased, has the pipe coming out horizontally, I'd much prefer if it was fitted with an elbow piece so it bent up 90 deg, doe anyone know if they are available, or something can be adapted ?. I want to drop the hose from above to relieve clutter in the bilge area and make it neater in there. hope I've explained myself clearly, should have taken a photo while I was tinkering.

Col

[scottar]

Couldn't wait for the new gunwale rubber to arrive, so used a piece of the old gunwale rubber to check my clearance underneath it for my out pipe.
I'm hoping the new rubber is the same width, as I drilled a 38mm hole thru the hull this arvo !.
Not sure whether i'm liking these plastic through hull fittings, found a place on line that sells them in Stainless, I'd much rather fit a stainless one, I figure it will last longer and would be better to seal to metal than those plastic parts.
The rule pump that I purchased, has the pipe coming out horizontally, I'd much prefer if it was fitted with an elbow piece so it bent up 90 deg, doe anyone know if they are available, or something can be adapted ?. I want to drop the hose from above to relieve clutter in the bilge area and make it neater in there. hope I've explained myself clearly, should have taken a photo while I was tinkering.


Col

Stainless is obviously stronger but I wouldn't stress over the plastic - no rust staining is probably the biggest bonus and they are in service every where. As to the 90 degree - 1 1/8 inch isn't a common size. If your hose Is stretchy enough ( heat will be your friend) you may be able to stretch it over a 1 1/4 inch elbow. Most spiral ribbed hose is pretty flexible and would bend to a similar radius without the fitting though.

[blacklab]

Thanks Scott, Yeah, I'm looking at the bilge area and I have the main fuel filler line , breathers, fuel/out line , now the bilge hose and it's starting to look cluttered, so having the bilge hose go up vertically would save space, BUT at the end of the day they all have to be there.
I haven't made up my mind on position of bilge pump or float switch yet, so I might just fit of and position other stuff first and then worry about that afterwards.
I have been thinking on someone else's comments previously, about just urathaneing the pump and float bases down in position, each at the same level, rather than mounting them on a pad, then recall your comment on the float switch ideally needing to be higher than the pump. Now, in reading the float switch spec's, it states the pump wont automatically switch on till the water level reaches 50mm and switches off when the level goes down to 19mm. So would that then be a suitable fitting position ?, just couldn't get my head around your reason. ( It does take longer for things to sink in for me ).

Col

[scottar]

If you look at the base of the pump Col, as soon as air hits the top of the slots in the side, the pump starts sucking air and loses prime - it sort of keeps going for a bit but it's not pumping properly. If the switch off height is too close to this level, the pump can reach a point with boat motion or sitting at a list where it is running but not pumping well enough to clear the water for it to reach the stop point. By mounting the switch on a pad higher than the pump, it gives a bit more leeway. Yes, there is always a bit of extra water in the bilge as the switch off point is a bit deeper but it can be cleared by switching the pump on manually if wanted. If you can mount the switch at the same level as the pump and it will never have this situation then that is fine - just want to make sure as they can't run dry indefinitely.

[blacklab]

Ahh, got it,
Thanks Scott, In having a wee play with the float switch, the click on and click off noise is quite clear, so I will sit them side by side and have a play with that, Il make sure it switches off, a safe margin above the top of the slots. And Your right, the auto function for me will be mainly used when the boat is in the water overnight, or I end up having a kip while doing a night fish, as a safety option, the rest of the time I would use the manual option.
Thank you Scott, well explained.

Col