help with size/weight

[gofishin]

... You will down grade your tow capacity if you upgrade the GVM of the cruiser.
Upgrade cruiser GVM to 3550kgs means your boat / trailer can only be 3300kgs = 6850kgs ( You cannot exceed this combined weight ).
I looked at every option.
Hope this helps.

Hi Rob, this is not correct, unfortunately you were given dud info.

The only reason this is not correct is because Toyota do not specify a GCM. Any changes to the GVM are therefore independent of the GCM, and thus towing capacity. (This as per ADR rules/legislation, ie Law).

However, if someone is providing a 'Claytons GVM upgrade' that specifies a derated towing capacity (or a GCM that derates the towing capacity) - walk away Kev! This is wasted money.

GVM upgrades for LC200's are very popular down south for the grey nomads with big vans - and they retain full 3.5t towing. Check out the caravan forums.
Cheers
Brendon


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Moejoes]

[QUOTE=gofishin;1596886]Kev, have a read of this thread, it may have some helpful info ...
So you think you can tow 3.5t http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/sho...d.php?t=202306

A GVM upgrade will not allow you to tow more than 3.5t, it will just allow you to carry more people/load in the cruiser, or unload some weight from the boat into the cruiser.

Toyota don't specify a GCM, so unless you find someone that is qualified and willing to give you an increased 'Tow Rating' or put a GCM number on a compliance plate (that will suit your situation), it will be an f-truck etc.

Start with ARB and Lovells. There is another option Soulfish (Jason) mentioned to me a few years back - can't recall who though. He may chime in.
Cheers
Brendon


Hey Brendon,
Jason put me onto that guy as well.
He wouldn't do any tow upgrades & said it can't be done.
They use to do it years ago but found engineers were signing of 2 wheel drive Hilux utes with 3500kgs tow capacities
I looked at every option , spoke to Dept. of Transport numerous times.
Unfortunately those are the rules.

[Moejoes]

One Dept of Transport officer told me I could transfer 350kgs into the car as long as I didn't exceed my GCVM of 6850kgs.
Meaning that my boat / trailer could be 3850kgs total weight and I can have 1 person with fuel in the car.
He said they have a massive manual listing all GCVM's for every vehicle.
He did also say that you needed to check each model of say example a Commodore as a standard model would have different specs to a SS model.
Eg: different brakes / suspension.
You need to call your local dealer to find out your GCVM ( Gross Combined Vehicle Mass ).
I'm now told load transfer is not legal in Qld.
Just be aware there are different tow rules & reg's per state.

[gofishin]

... I looked at every option , spoke to Dept. of Transport numerous times.
Unfortunately those are the rules.

That's the problems we have in the 'smart state' unfortunately Rob, the amount of miss-information and completely different information from people at QLD Transport - who should know or be trained better!

I had it myself years ago when setting up my boat, thought they would have got their sh!t sorted by now. So much so that the guy I finally got on to (senior, very experienced and well trained and familiar with laws and ADR's) was very embarrassed and couldn't apologise enough - but that was 7 yrs ago!

I will try and dig up some info - but it sounds like it is going to be a hard task finding someone in QLD to do it.
Cheers


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Moejoes]

Agree Brendon,
Good luck with it Kemel.
You could save probably 200 to 300kgs by going a single motor & ali trailer.
Just remember the 400kgs of fuel / water you'll put in it depending on range you're looking for.
Petrol weighs about 0.748kg's per litre, so 500 litres would weigh 374kgs.
Maybe stop at the Maryborough inspection bays & have a chat to them next time they are there as they'll probably the one's you'll be arguing with if pulled up

Rob

[gofishin]

Is this called 'tennis or ping-pong posting' Rob ...

One Dept of Transport officer told me I could transfer 350kgs into the car as long as I didn't exceed my GCVM of 6850kgs...

There is his/their first two mistakes.
1. All states are now under common laws regarding this, and common terminology based on terms defined under ADR's. It is GCM. Previously some States called it different names, but there is one name defined under Law for all states of Australia, and that is "Gross Combination Mass" (GCM). You would think that the most over-governed developed country in the world would be able to sort this out ?

2. By Law only the manufacturer can provide a GCM. For this class of vehicle, a GCM is not required to be provided by Law. What's more, QLD transport, or anyone cannot add the GVM and towing capacity together and write the figure down as the GCM - nor measure anyone's rig against it. They can only measure separately against GVM, and then ATM (GVM would obviously be taken with the trailer coupled, so that the towball mass is included). Obviously to remain legal, you would need to be under in both cases.

... Just be aware there are different tow rules & reg's per state.

There used to be, not any more. Different rules created a nightmare for authorities, so we're changed for obvious reasons. Some states may still be behind in updating their own paperwork/backyard, but under Federal laws we are now all the same.

I will get off my high-horse now .

As you might have guessed, this sort of bureaucratic crap from people working for Government Departments, who's job is to know better, gets me going...
Cheers
Brendon


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Moejoes]

Gezzzz Hi Ho Silver!!!!!
I had a gut full of it as well as you could never get a straight answer from them.
Most of my findings are from 2 years ago so there could be some new updates as you mentioned.
I recall reading Nomad forums where they are legal in NSW but when entered WA they would be fined for being illegal or vice versa as they entered different states.
Good to see the towing rules are all common now if the case.
All I know is that I'm now legal & don't have to worry about being uninsured and loosing everything in the event of a major accident especially if there were fatalities.
Cheers Rob

[gofishin]

...
All I know is that I'm now legal & don't have to worry about being uninsured and loosing everything in the event of a major accident especially if there were fatalities.
Cheers Rob

And that's the only way to be I reckon.

PS. Bloody nice boat Rob, but I think you could do with a bigger shed

Cheers
Brendon




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Moejoes]

[QUOTE=gofishin;1596904]And that's the only way to be I reckon.

PS. Bloody nice boat Rob, but I think you could do with a bigger shed

Cheers
Brendon


Haha
Thanks Brendon. I raised the roof to 4mtrs entrance and extended from 7.5 to 10 mtrs deep to get in out 😆

[scottar]

Scotty, thanks for that. GVM upgrade sounds great!!how do you go about those never heard of it? only new to forum so not sure who bil is. upgrade to GVM sounds far cheaper than a f- truck/dodge to tow it around when so close to the mark.
tar KEV

BIL = brother in law, Kemel. Brendan is spot on with his info on the GVM upgrade. The issue with 200's is the abysmal payload - from memory about 700kg - this has to cover people, fuel, any of the trick toys we like to bolt to our rigs like heavy steel bull bars, winches, draw systems, bigger tyres, roof racks, extra batteries, tools and the like as well as the approximate 10% of the tow weight on the towball. You can get a 200 series over factory GVM just by filling all the seats with adults let alone a steel bar, 130 litres of fuel and a 350kg down weight on the back end. The upgrade does not allow the towing of more than 3500kgs - It just let's you take passengers as well as tow the boat.

The GVM upgrade is a certified suspension upgrade. There are two available through either ARB or Lovell's suspension (the ARB one has a lower upgrade than the Lovell's). There used to be the option of a tow weight upgrade as well as reported by at least one caravaner but I believe this has been knocked on the head. There are/were some different limitations on the upgrade due to red tape technicalities in some states due to pre/post registration fitment but best to talk to your upgrader as hopefully (fingers crossed) they should be more up to speed than myself. There is plenty more info on Landcruiser Owners On Line (LCOOL) if you wish to join and have a read.

[ric]

an 8m boat under 3.5t loaded on trailer would ride like a pig. Having length is fine but you need the weight to.

[lee8sec]

Pedders also do GVM kits. http://www.pedders.com.au/kits/gvm-upgrades

Some kits are for NEW vehicles only.

This is all the important parts for the lovells kit. GVM & tow capacity.
http://rvcs-prodweb.dot.gov.au/perl/...2008123251.cmd

[Alwayskeen]

Some nice boats here. I just wish this dilemma was mine....

[KEMEL K]

Thanks to all very interesting reading all that info. seems to me that quite a lot of car trailer combos will be illegal in one way or another due to all the confusion around theses very issues. With the blame game shared between differing govts and car manufacturers alike. Taken a keen interest in anything towing trailers in the last couple of days including the huge combos some of these grey nomads are getting around in. Bloody hell what are some of these things weighing in at, huge van tinny on top and canopy over duel cab ute full and I mean full of gear!!!! Going to discuss with builder and do our sums a few times and just build as big and close as we can to the magical 3.5t mark. leaving fuel fill to last servo before ramp, and take my chances like most others it seems. Thanks heaps guys I think,heads spinning that's for sure but very informative that's for sure.
Met Kev (marvin) yestie at tackle shop hoping to get to agnes for the m&g next month for sausage cook off and meet and thank a few personally may run the eye over a few big hard top plateys for ideas while there. Be a couple of them there by the sounds of it, and being only a bit over an hour pretty easy run for me.
KEV

[Oog.]

Hi Kev, my boat is the slightly bigger, (and not as pretty), sister to Mick's Outwide.
I went with a single engine over twin 175's for various reasons, but one of them was the weight saving of about 180kgs on the bum and also the overall boat weight.
The alloy trailer was weighed at finished stage, including the spare bolted on, and came in at 600kg.
So by Rob's weight of his galv trailer, the weight saving can be closer to 500kg with my setup.
When mine was weighed before the fit-out, with only the motor and start batteries fitted and a hundred or so litres of fuel it was about 2900kgs.
I have not weighed it again yet since I have fitted it out but it would have added another 300kg or so.
So by the time the fuel and water tanks are full, add some ice and all the other gear you take fishing, it would be over the 3500kg, so I like others have said, try to tow it fairly empty till almost at the ramp.
I will weigh it next time I'm in town and let you know how it went.
Who are you looking at to build your new boat?, if you want to have a look over mine or go for a run, send me your number.
Ross.