the lucky country? .... "Just value what you have and don't give it away"

[Jabiru658]

Sure, you cant use semi or fully automatic weapons, but outside of the military why would you need one anyway?

Vermin control on farms is MUCH easier with a semi-automatic than with a bolt action rifle (seriously), our family no longer has a farm so it doesn't effect me personally but that doesn't change the facts for a large number of disadvantaged farmers with vermin issues.

And there are a number of international sporting events that require semi-automatic guns to compete in, sporting shooters wishing to compete in those events cannot normally purchase the guns to do so which has wiped out whole sections of the target shooting market hurting sales and jobs.

That's just two reasons.

On top of these there is the whole 'divide and conquer' problem, by politically isolating hunters from fishers and from 4 wheel drivers and dirt bike riders (and from each other) and splitting the 'outdoor lobby' into smaller groups the government (and more worryingly the Greens) can 'manage' us easier, that's not a good outcome in the long run for any of us.

[Lovey80]

At the end of the day, the number of deaths by firearm is on a steady downward trend and has been since the changes to gun ownership laws, regardless of what anyone says. You can cherry pick as much data as you want, but the numbers are there in black and white. I dont think tight gun controls are a bad thing. If you want to use a firearm, you still can. I dont see the problem. Sure, you cant use semi or fully automatic weapons, but outside of the military why would you need one anyway?

This is always the same attitude and argument of someone who's liberty isn't being trampled all over. It is you who cherry picks data by only looking at gun crime statistics from the Port Arthur tragedy onwards. You are right the numbers are there in black and white and they prove you wrong. Gun crime statistics were falling well before the anomaly that started all this and take away the 1996 tragedy from the stats and you have a very clear downward trend going back well before that day.

There are many sports shooting activities that required semi-automatic weapons before the ban. Even sports pistol shooting has become prohibitive with ridiculous regulations that make no one safer. The regulations aren't there to simply ensure that firearms don't end up in the wrong hands they are there to try to make it so these firearms end up in no ones hands.

[Louis]

"On top of these there is the whole 'divide and conquer' problem, by politically isolating hunters from fishers and from 4 wheel drivers and dirt bike riders (and from each other) and splitting the 'outdoor lobby' into smaller groups the government (and more worryingly the Greens) can 'manage' us easier, that's not a good outcome in the long run for any of us."

Spot on Jabiru. We need to stick together


Louis

[snapperbasher]

Jabiru...

Primary Producers can still own Semi automatic weapons undera category R licence. Vermin control on a rural property is a genuine reason toapply for a category R licence.

People who need them can still legally own them if you canshow “genuine reason”

I am a gun owner and avid hunter. There is no need for semiautomatic weapons for general hunting and or sports.... even though it would benice!! J

[Louis]

I wonder how many lives could have been saved and how much misery to families and patients could have been avoided if the Howard Government had put that money they used to confiscate guns from law abiding citizens to the study for a cure for cancer and other illnesses instead?


Louis

[snapperbasher]

I agree Louis.... I don’t believe the Introduction of theGun laws after Port Arthur has saved any lives.....bloody great big waste ofmoney...... and I lost my favourite pump action shotty!!

Money could have been much better spent.... however I stilldon’t believe anyone needs a Semi Auto or Auto firearm for generalhunting/Sports....I don’t see the banning of them as a negative.

The whole Pump Action Shotgun thing is ridiculous.....ConsideringPump Action Rifles are still legal??? Go figure..... shows the misunderstandingof firearms of those who designed and implemented the laws....

[Louis]

We should also remember that we were not invaded by the Japanese during WW2 due to the fact that "Australians are well armed and well trained in the use of their arms and that it is predicted that any occuping troops would come under sustained and prolonged sniper attack".

This was obviously written in Japanese. But this is a rough translation of intellingence reports which were tendered to the Japanese Government by Japanese Inteligence Officials.

L

[Louis]

If the USA suffers an economic collapse, or perhaps rather when the USA suffers an economic collapse, and we no longer have them to protect us, will the Indonesian Government feel the same way about the Australia of today I wonder?


L

[Lovey80]

Jabiru...

Primary Producers can still own Semi automatic weapons undera category R licence. Vermin control on a rural property is a genuine reason toapply for a category R licence.

People who need them can still legally own them if you canshow “genuine reason”

I am a gun owner and avid hunter. There is no need for semiautomatic weapons for general hunting and or sports.... even though it would benice!! J

Just being a primary producer isn't enough for a category R licence for a semi-automatic centre fire rifle. Pump Action shotgun yes. You need to be on massive land with a huge feral animal population OR be in feral animal eradication as a profession to get a semi-auto rifle.

This argument about what the "need" is for a semi-auto is what angers me the most. The anti-gun lobby has all of us having the debate right where they want it. Just the fact that avid hunters are even going down the "need" conversation means that they have won and will continue to win and enforce stronger regulations on everyone.

The facts are that had the Tasmanian gun laws that were already been on the books, been enforced, Port Arthur would never have happened. Law abiding, sane minded citizens don't go on murderous high body count rampages in Australia on a regular basis. For the same reasons that those same people (with the new laws) don't go on low body count murderous rampages on a regular basis. Yet, bikies, drug dealers and anyone who already has the utmost disregard for the law have no restriction on them what so ever. Laws like this don't stop what they were designed to stop. I would have loved to have seen the backlash energy go more towards screening for mental issues etc than curbing the rights of people who were never going to be a problem.

Right now with a bit of cash anyone could obtain a semi-auto weapon to go on a killing spree in pretty short time. So what have we really achieved?

[Lovey80]

If the USA suffers an economic collapse, or perhaps rather when the USA suffers an economic collapse, and we no longer have them to protect us, will the Indonesian Government feel the same way about the Australia of today I wonder?


L

Lets say the answer is no. What are they going to do about it?

[nathank]

I will take our gun laws and health care over america anyday of the week.. the thing i really really hate about australia though is the way we constantly whinge and whinge about how hard done by we are, also the way a lot of us want our Aussie stars to fail.. I had a mate put on facebook a little while ago how he couldnt wait to see federra smash Hewit in the tennis final and so many others got on the bandwagon..makes me sick. Harry Kewel had a tribute page for his retirement the other day also and about 80% we saying how useless he was etc.. Im gunna stop now because i could write a book...

[Jabiru658]

Jabiru...

Primary Producers can still own Semi automatic weapons undera category R licence. Vermin control on a rural property is a genuine reason toapply for a category R licence.

Not one of my grand fathers dairy farm neighbours were able to obtain one despite the endemic vermin issue in the area, that suggests strongly to me that the requirements are out of sync with the needs of farmers (at least ones on small farms around here).

[Louis]

Lets say the answer is no. What are they going to do about it?

Lovey, they could have every town and city in Australia under their total control within 48hrs if they wanted to.

Thank God for the Americans protecting us. And when the USA collapses hopefully China will step up and protect us.


Louis

[uripper]

Hey fellas,

As the initial poster of this thread I respect your thoughts as I do anyone in this Oz democracy, though I suggest if you want to have an argy-bargy about gun control or other political difference ... this is not the place. Post your own thread pls.

The thread was about a whole lot more. It was about stuff like this ... places where kids /families, & lovers can stroll freely enjoying the sunshine, surfers blending with the sea, fishos returning to harbour after a morning offshore, elders sitting quietly in morning reflection of life ... all in relative safety ... yes, there are many places more or less like this in the world ... but none quite like the land I call home.

These pics were taken in the last 4 days at Pt Danger and Shorncliffe ... food for thought.

cheers, Mal

Pt Danger paradise#.jpgShorncliffe Jetty 20140408#.jpg

[sparkyice]

an interesting read for sure, from my perspective as a yank. i admire austrailians for all of the reasons put forth in this thread, and for the way you can carry on an intelligent discusion without allowing the tone to degenerate into mindless rants about one anothers character.

hope you don't mind if i post a link to this thread onto a fishing forum here at home, " lake ontario united". i want to share your perspective with some of my neighbors. we have a lot more in common than many might realize.

thank you.

http://www.lakeontariounited.com/fis...e-perspective/