Hi all I am looking at buying a new tinny and a dealer told me that 2 stroke engines will be banned in fresh water next year. Except for E TEC is this true ?
Cheers Gav
Hi all I am looking at buying a new tinny and a dealer told me that 2 stroke engines will be banned in fresh water next year. Except for E TEC is this true ?
Cheers Gav
they have been talking about it for years, Overseas they have done it but dont think its something happening here just yet, Would be met by a lot of resistance from the Boating community.
Cheers
It put the wind up me a bit as I have a 90 OPTI MAX on my Nitro that I only use in the fresh and a 3.3 on my canoe . I was looking at a tinny for crabing and NT trip but after I was told that I thought I might have to scrap that idea to repower with 4 strokes.
Cheers Gav
mate, there's been talk of conventional 2 strokes not being available for sale brand new any more (which seems to have suddenly dropped off the radar lately) but i'm unaware of any move to ban them from fresh water other than impoundments where they are already not allowed.
I'd say he was wanting you to buy an Etec. If they want to ban 2 stroke outboards - then that's ALL 2 strokes.Originally Posted by gav73
That's what I'm hearing.
Barring some damming environmentle report on outboard polution in our drinking water I doubt much will change.
At the moment the only lake I can think of in SEQ that seperates 2st & 4st is Lenthalls. It has 4 strokes and only 3 star 2 strokes (Optimax & Etec only) up to 60hp, all normal 2 strokes (not Optimax or Etec) are banned.
If, and it's a big if, Wivenhoe is opened up to outboards I would imagine it would be 4strokes plus Optimaxs & Etecs only. These are just my opinions though.
Cheers
Mike D
I personally would be looking for another dealer.
Ask him to show it to you in writing.
Who knows what other lies he has told you.
Boat sales persons same level as Politicians,car sales, realestate and insurance most lower than a black snakes rsole.
Cheers
Ray
yep, i'd be looking somewhere else too.
The only problem is that we where told we will not have a carbon tax as well !
Thanks for your replys I had a grand plan of getting a new tinny and I have just taken one dealer off the list. He looked like he would rip his mum off to make a quick buck.
Cheers Gav
Weren't Green Zones met with a lot of resistance back in the day?????
It would all come down to the star rating of the engine not weather it was a 2 or 4 stroke, are all 4 strokes 3 star???
So is this a possibility in the future?? How awesome would that be!! Bring it on, where did you hear about this Mike?
Cheers
Scott
"Mystique" Haines Signature 580BR with 175 of Mr Suzuki's finest ponies
Your dealer was slightly mixed up.
There is a definite target to introduce emission standardsfor all small engines, including outboards and lawn mowers.
This has been in progress since 2005. In 2006 I sat on the National experts panelalong with the CEO’s of the 6 major outboard companies. We met every few weeks over the year, and Ihave been in touch with the issue ever since.
Cost Benefit Analysis was done in 2009 and 2010 and the Publicconsultation (Regulatory Impact statement) was completed about July 2010.
The stated target s for regulations to commence in 2012. ALL of the outboard companies and the OPEA (representinggardening equipment) have stated that they are in favour of regulations –though there are some differences of opinion about timing and certainexemptions eg military outboards andlight weight chain saws.
In 2009 the Australian Boat Building Standards AS1799 wasupdated to allow for heavier 4 strokes.
The USA has had outboard emission standards for about 12years and it’s the USA standard we are to copy. Europe has had regulations for years andwill move toward matching the US standard. So has Canada and Japan. Crikeyeven China and India have introduced standards for small engines.
Basically all that will pass will be 4 strokes, E-TEC(except 300hp),some Verado, some Optimax Tohatsu TLDI. Yamaha HPDI won’t pass. Basically every CARB or OEDA 3 star engine will pass. All these have less than 30 units ofpollution per kW per hour (most below 15). NO carby or efi two stroke will pass - the cleanest is over 100 units ofemissions up to 600. For a full listbuy a copy of F&B Magazine.
In addition boats with built in tanks will need to stopevaporation of fuel – with a tank ullage or overflow and a carbon filter on thebreather tube.
ALL OF THIS WILL ONLY AFFECT NEW IMPORTS OR MANUFACTUREDPRODUCTS AFTER A CERTAIN DATE. NOTHING YOU OWN NOW WILL BE “BANNED”
However, Wide Bay Water Corporation (Lake Lenthalls) have instituted and increasingly tougherstandard. They started off with a planto ban anything over 6hp for pollution reasons which was crazy (see below) It ended up that they will eventually banall carby and efi two strokes.
The following numbers are extracted from the USA EPAdatabase. The numbers come from the outboardcompanies own testing, certified by them, and audited by the USA EPA. So please, all you self-opinionatedAusfishers, don’t bother saying “impossible”
So why all the fuss over two strokes? They are incredibly highly polluting. A simple popular 2 stroke lawn mower pushesout 40 (forty) times the pollutants (HC+NOx) per hour of a small car.
An 8hp pre mix 2 stroke pushes out 60% more HC + NOx than a150hp four stroke in the same brand.
NONE of this has anything to do with Carbon. So let’s not confuse the two issues.
Any sensible questions I’m happy to answer.
And Yes - one of my goals is to have Wivenhoe opened up toreal boating - for clean engines. Aswell as many dams / lakes completely closed in NSW. Currently I am working with fishinggroups/ local government on a Trout Lake in Tasmania.
I’m not a mad Greenie. And two stokes is an excuse for them to close down fishing. A stick to beat us up with. Opening more fishing areas, and avoiding moreclosures is my goal. I achieved thatwith Lenthalls and hopefully Tasmania. I’vehad a tilt at opening Wivenhoe – got as far as the Mayor’s office and to hissenior staff - and hit a wall of stupidity. But I’ll try again.
I know that some readers loaded with opinion and lackingfacts will oppose me. That’s why I don’twrite here often. It’s no fun arguingwith anonymous Neanderthals.
Sigh
Gary
Gary
Thanks for the info. I think that you may have posted a lot of it previously.
Was it Cando who you hit the brick wall with?
I certainly hope that SEQ water may have a change of attitude when they finally complete their review of recreational use of dams but seriously doubt whether much will change as there is a lot of resistance to allowing petrol powered craft on the dams within the fishing community itself.
My opinion is that it will take a long time before the government moves to institute any changes to current regulation re 2 stroke motors.
People selling CARB and OEDA 3 motors have been rowing their boat and using scare tactics for quite a few years now.
Etech and honda in particular as that is all that they sell.
There is a big difference between banning the sale of new 2 strokes and a complete ban on them and a lot of the sales people fail to point this out in the hope of getting a new sale.
My personal opinion for what it is worth is that you have an old 2 stroke and you are happy with it keep on using it till it stops. The new 4 strokes and etechs are certainly very nice and more economical to run but on a pure economics base you will never recover the price difference on fuel savings alone.
Cheers
Ray
Cheers
Ray
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