I have both chargers, a Super Cheap 10 amp Calibre and a CTek 10 amp. I stopped using the Calibre as it boiled my battery dry more than once, since using the CTek I have not had a problem. I tend to leave my batteries on charge for a week or two not just over night.
Maturity is not when we start speaking BIG things,it is when we start understanding small things
Have you still got the calibre charger? If you do, can I take a look at it?Originally Posted by tropicrows
I'll try and remember to have a look in the shed tonight, or it could be over at my partners place. Anyway leave it with me and i'll get back to you.
Maturity is not when we start speaking BIG things,it is when we start understanding small things
Building a battery charger even a multi stage charger isn't by any means heavy electronic design.
Hell you can probaly buy the whole thing in a chip......many of the sealed battery powered portable PA systems have a 2 stage chip charger built into them.....a few passive components and a 5 pin power package.
I am sure the semiconductor manufacturers would be selling a chip or two.
So any self respecting asian manufacturer should be able to make a decent fist of a battery charger.
Jaycar, supercheap, repco..all reasonable suspects for stocking a reasonable charger at a decent price......funny some of them look suspicioulsy similar too.
cheers
Its the details, those little details, that make the difference.
Andy,
I found the charger but's its only a 6 amp unit. PM me if you still want to have a look at it.
Maturity is not when we start speaking BIG things,it is when we start understanding small things
That's probably why my Ctek has a temp sensor,
Does that temperature sensor go onto the battery Mike??
If so then it's a big step up from the norm and a feature well worth having to extend the life of a battery.
I intend on living for-ever....so far so good
Mate I would love to put it to the test.
A lot of fancy chargers wont charge from flat, or wont charge a crook battery. The calibre does not discriminate, if your battery is drawing current from it, it will keep feeding it. I suspect this may have been the case, however until we put it to the test one will never know!
I have only seen commercial/industrial chargers with battery temp sensors. Most temp sensors on consumer chargers are to adjust the charge voltage based on ambient temperature. Temp sensors on commercial chargers are usually just a protection mechanism.
Yeh it's touching the casing of my 2 deep cycles, the Ctek monitors the temp and adjusts accordingly. At comps I regularly need to do a full recharge overnight (esp if very windy) and the 2 x 130amphrs Trojans require a bit but it charges them easy. And I don't want to pay $160 to enter an ABT comp and have the amount of charge in my batteries determine my game plan on the last day.
It's also got a recovery mode that I havn't used but a couple of mates have borrowed it to improve the performance of their old batteries, they recon it made a big difference. In my case I also like being able to mount the Ctek in the boat, and I would worry about relying on a very basic charger to maintain $800+ worth of batteries, they also last me much longer now that I've got a good charger.
Andy, I've found you'll have probs if you try to put more into a Deep Cycle than it's holding, ie 10amps into a deep cycle battery that is so flat it's only holding say 4amps . If you put it on a 1amp trickle charger for several hours to get it started and build it up you can then switch it over to the bigger charger. Some chargers like my Ctek will automatically do it for you.
Cheers
I am trying to dechipher what you are saying.
"I've found you'll have probs if you try to put more into a Deep Cycle than it's holding, ie 10amps into a deep cycle battery that is so flat it's only holding say 4amps"
For a start, a battery does not hold 4 amps, it holds a charge, measured in amp hours, two very different concepts.. Secondly, you cant put 10amps into a battery, a battery may draw 10amps, but you cant force it in.
A charger that moniters battery temp, will have a temp sensor bolted to one of the battery terminals, so I reckon you CTEK charger is only compensating for ambient temp.
"It's also got a recovery mode that I havn't used but a couple of mates have borrowed it to improve the performance of their old batteries, they recon it made a big difference."
I "Reckon" it wont make much difference. Thats my scientific approach! But I "reckon" your mates have it sorted.
If I were to buy a fancy charger, I would look at a xantrex charger. They are probably shit though, cause they dont have 20 stages.
A lot of fancy chargers wont charge from flat, or wont charge a crook battery. The calibre does not discriminate, if your battery is drawing current from it, it will keep feeding it. I suspect this may have been the case, however until we put it to the test one will never know!
True, they need a voltage from the battery so the 'smart' figures out what charge it should start at.
Big 'no no' to flatten any battery, but it happens. With smart chargers you need to 'jump' start the charge process using jumper leads from another battery for 5 minutes until some charge is read by the charger and then it is away.
I have the Projecta 10amp 7 stage purchased from fleabay for just over $200 and also have 4 others from 40amp to 1amp trickle, but I wont use anything else now.
I have various vehicles and machinery and maintain nine 650 cold crank amps, a few 26hr gels, a 100 deep agm and a few others and this charger does all very well.
I was always paranoid about forgetting a charger is on a battery, particularly the 40amp, and destroying the battery. Now I just rotate the smart charger from battery to battery if there is need to maintain any not being used for a few weeks.
I know little about the electronics and lingo, just relating what I use and do
Cheers
There are so may myths and misconceptions about lead acid batteries, which is sad, because they are one of the best documented electrical items we have.
There are heaps of good resources available on the internet, some of the best are publised by the major battery companies.
I do agree that many of the fancy multistage chargers will not begin to charge some batteries in certain conditions, particularly older batteries that have been allowed to discharge too far.....I have seen this first hand.....I just cant help myself I have to try to revive lost causes....I keep an old style transformer rectifier charger for that purpose.
Quite often deeply discharged batteries will not easily accept charge, after a few hours on the old clunker they will begin to accept charge......once they are at that point they will usually run on the multistage charger.
There are all sorts of claims that this or that charger will not fully charge this or that battery "fully". I have not seen any of these claims from battery manufacturers.
The simple fact is that if you apply the correct voltage and supply sufficient current, any salvagable lead acid battery will fully charge given enough time.
Yes some of the fancy chargers will get more charge to stick, more quickly, but that is a different thing.
One thing I have learned in the last few years, is that we can no longer make certain broad bassed assumptions about batteries and battery types.
We realy do have to look at the manufacturers information.
The notion that you can not fast charge gell type batteries used to be universal.
Allong with a certain pattern of behaviour.......this is still true for some gell batteries, but not for others.
The clear distinction between gel, other sealed, AGM, and wet cell batteries is no longer there as manufactueres use methods and chemistries from other battery types.
Almost all sealed battery manufactuers gell their electrolite to some extent, almost all sealed battery manufacturers have there electrolite absorbed or imobilised in glass mat somehow, A great many battery manufacturers sealed and wet are using calcuim to some extent in their batteries.
What makes this battery a "True GEL" battery or an "True AGM" battery or what ever is a very good question.....a question I am yet to find an answer I am satisfied with.
As far as slow charging batteries being advantageous.....still not convinced......charging at the 10 hour rate seems to be universaly recommended as ideal.
Fast charging, apparantly will be less efficient and harder on the battery, as to a given battery tolerating a certain charging rate.....Oh hell......ya just cant make a generalisation anymore....all you can do is refeer to the manufacturers specs and prove them iff you can.
I have tried to charge 2 different 7.5Ah sealed batteries direct from a car charging system one would only accept arround 3 or 4 amps a rapid charge but still safeish, the other drew something like 15 -20 amps and got very hot very quickly, experiment rapidly terminated......same car same cable same instruments.
As far as reviving batteries........quite often all it takes is a proper charge under good conditions.........
Some people have small chargers and simply do not give the battery enough time to charge.....if you have a 1 amp charger on a 120AH battery particularly if it is older it may never fully charge that battery, the charging losses may be greater than the charger can deliver.
If you have a deeply discharged battery, regardless of the size of the battery or charger it may take 12 to 16 hours to charge fully......then agian it may not.
I have tried one of the pulse type battery reconditioners......and it seems to work......but it takes several days or more to make a difference.
As for the fancy chargers... many of them have some form of pulse mode which may help in this situation..... but I have doubts about it helping in a single cycle charge.
Applying an "equalising charge" may produce an improvement quickly, as this may rectify a lazy cell that is not getting up to charge as quickly as its neibours.
But this is nothing more that a quickish charge for a given period longer than a normal cycle charge.
Unfortunately there are many people who do not wish to take the time to understand, combine that with those of us who try our best to explain in simple terms....and we end up with a case of battery chineese wispers and all this misinformation.
There are all sorts of conditions like "acid stratification", "calcium charge resistance" and others that we could blab on about that slow or prevent charging.
But the bottom line is correct voltage, sufficient current and enough time will solve most basic charging problems.
AND of course some of the cheaper competently designed multi stage chargers are a very good proposition.
AND any multistage that works properly will be much better for your battery than an old transformer/ rectifier clunker.
cheers
Its the details, those little details, that make the difference.
Unbeleivable. Post up some truths and get flogged.
I think I might just give up posting technical answers, so many experts out there. I guess what I learned in my trade and at uni is all wrong.
No probaly not wrong, just the products have changed and maybe how we can use them.
Beleive me I have had to change my mind on things, I beleieved from my training, some of them turned out to be wrong, others just changed.
Particularly this battery stuff.....I have been reading I reasarching this stuff for over 2 years now.....and things have changed.
And there are some answers I am sill looking for.
Particularly how certain batteries behave and what they will tolerate.
The safe generalisations of the past just aren't as reliable as they once were.
I am always happy to be corrected where someone can provide good documentation.
Don't stop posting mate, your input is valued and respected by many of us.
cheers
Its the details, those little details, that make the difference.
TheRealAndy
I read the posts and I cannot find anything that was posted about you being wrong, in fact, your read was interesting as was 'oldboots' and I learnt something from both of you, so I dont know how you were 'flogged'
I agreed with you, smartchargers wont charge a flat battery, but you can jump start them. Its in the manuals of most smartchargers, and it works.
The rest of my post was about what I use, what I do, and my experiences with batteries and chargers, right way or wrong way, which is exactly what a forum is all about.
I am sure there are many qualified people on this forum in a vast arena of different fields and trades, as I am, Uni also, but not electronics as I have only a basic understanding of it and learn from reading forums and the internet and find most peoples opinions interesting.
If you post something of a technical nature, you are sure to get alternate opinions, --- in the english language its called a 'forum'.
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