Reply With QuoteA typical remark from a Government that has utterly lost it's way.
When the local BP (Cleveland) changes over I will no longer buy standard fuel, either.
Tim
Ethanol mandate could strip regular unleaded fuel option from southeast Queensland motorists
by Ursula Heger
<LI class="source ">From: The Courier-Mail <LI class="date-and-time ">September 06, 2010 12:00AM REGULAR unleaded petrol could be stripped from most southeast Queensland service stations when the state's ethanol mandate is introduced at the end of the year, fuel industry experts have warned.
Motorists are already struggling to find service stations that stock regular unleaded fuel, after petrol companies began removing the bowsers and replacing them with the 10 per cent ethanol-blend, known as E10, ahead of the mandate.
Up to 166 of the state's 900 service stations, predominantly across the southeast, have removed regular unleaded bowsers, including 123 of BP's 329 Queensland service stations, 33 Caltex sites and six Shell sites.
But while E10 is between 2¢ and 3¢ a litre cheaper than regular unleaded, it is consumed at a higher rate – meaning motorists spend more money using the biofuel.
The oil companies say they have had to convert the service stations ahead of the State Government's planned introduction of a 5 per cent ethanol quota, which will require almost 50 per cent of fuel sold in the state to be E10.
Independent retailer Neumann Petroleum has converted four of its 75 sites, but executive general manager Charles Wright said the retailer would struggle to meet the ethanol quotas.
He said the introduction of the ethanol mandate would see oil companies focus on converting predominantly southeastern petrol stations to only sell the ethanol-blended fuel or premium products.
"What you are probably going to see to meet the mandate, is that the southeast corner will be predominantly E10, so that when you add the whole state together you come up with your quota," Mr Wright said.
A spokesman for Mobil, which has converted 26 service stations in Queensland to sell E10 but continues to offer regular unleaded at all retailers, said it would be difficult to continue to offer a choice.
"At least 50 per cent of your regular unleaded sales have to be E10, you can't achieve that very readily though continuing to offer a choice to customers – you won't get there," he said.
Peak-motoring body RACQ spokesman Gary Fites said the southeast's motorists would increasingly struggle to find regular unleaded fuels as the mandate is introduced.
He said up to 30 per cent of motorists could not safely run their cars on ethanol-blended fuels, meaning they will have to pay an extra 10¢ to 12¢ for premium fuels.
The State Government plans to introduce legislation for the ethanol mandate this month or next.
Treasurer Andrew Fraser, who is responsible for the mandate's introduction, refused to answer questions from The Courier-Mail. But a statement released from his office said the ethanol mandate "preserves choice" in the state.
The ethanol mandate "preserves choice" in the state this guy must be on drugs.
What a foolish thing to say when they are removing one fuel and forcing another on to us and if you dont want to use it or cant as is the case with boats you only have one other fuel.
I for one wont use ethanol blended fuel in any of my petrol powered motors so I will have to buy premium hows that for choice.
Cheers Axl
A typical remark from a Government that has utterly lost it's way.
When the local BP (Cleveland) changes over I will no longer buy standard fuel, either.
Tim
Carbon Really Ain't Pollution.
gotta say, thank god my next car is going to be deisel (though the ethanol mandate is one of the reasons I'm going the deisel route), I already put premium in the boat so no drama's there.
We will not buy standard fuel when the mandate comes here either, it certainly is a problem for the boat but my fuel regime is one where no fuel ever gets laid up for longer than a week or so..it's always evacuated right down to the fuel in the carbs.
Ethanol seems to be coming to a tank of diesel near to you too! although I thought it was not well possible it seems around the net people think it is...do not know what to think of it...more power possibly due to pre-combustion at 22%
Just found this 'response' to ethanol-deisel blends from Cummins, so apparently it is possible to blend the 2. A lot of negative side effects though, more dangerous to handle and store, refuelling dangers, detonation, inefficiency the list goes on and I'm not halfway through reading it yet.
http://www.environment.gov.au/atmosp...s-diesohol.pdf
Needless to say Cummins are opposed to using these blends in their engines.
I couldn't find what they are responding to, but have only done a quick google so far.
Baised information maybe, but afterall they are only loking out for the reputation of their product, and they are of the opinion that ethanol will hurt this and i vehemently agree.
I wonder how you'd go importing your own untainted deisel??
From a quick look at that whatever happens truck and diesel car accidents will become more spectacular, a 2 deg c flash (off) point for ethanol means it holds as the perfect precursor for accidental spills to ignite.
Collateral damage is philosophically ok historically in this country as it's not news worthy, what's a a few hundred maimed and a few 10s killed compared to the great on the ground benefit it will yield....somehow, magical, in that other dimension somewhere, over some rainbow or pot of gold for the very few.
If a true and honest investigation considered it a bad overall idea we will see it mandated that's a given.
Personally I trust the word of Cummins above all other industry voices and to the moon and back above any domestic engine/car/motor maker.
Bob Katter has just gone with the coalition and part of the agreement is 10% ethanol Australia wide. Of course Bob wants it to come from QLD sugar. Bob katter - doing it for his own tribe.
Was agreed by both parties
Who Hoo now the games begin!
I too am going to by diesel cars my wife wants a Holden Cruze no worries i thought ill get a diesel one then I will update my 4wd to a diesel.
I was not aware that they were looking at putting ethanol into diesel lets hope common sense prevals and this doesnt happen.
The damage it will do will far out way the bennifits to the cane growers and I am sure the trucking industry would have alot to say on this matter.
Cheers Axl
If Katter gets any swing in the ethanol debate there will be E20 in most bowsers, not E10. Has there been a govt response about compensation for outboard users forced into E10?
Jack.
Re: Here comes the Ethanol
Again I'm dumfounded-certainly not unusual these days.A scientific news release put out by the sugar industry gives a whole lot of figures relating to the use of ethanol in petrol driven cars.One of those figures relate to the calorific value of E10(being the energy produced when burnt),and that figure specified that E10 was 3% LESS efficient than standard fuel and that therefor meant that a car would use 3% MORE fuel when useing 10%ethanol blend to cover the same distance when compared to standard fuel.
So ethanol is being held up as a savior of greenhouse gases but causes a vehicle to use 3% more fuel-so how can that be.
It is also being marketed that it is cheaper to buy and perhaps in dollar terms it is -BUT in REAL terms it is NOT,a saving at the bowser of 4c in $1.30 is around 3% BUT you use 3% more fuel so no saving-and in fact go backwards when the price of fuel goes above $1.20.
And as in Victoria,when all fuel is E10 and there are no signs up marketing the price difference of E10 as a sales tool.the price of ALL petrol will sneak up another 4C a litre.
Petrol companies are loving this lot,they sell 3% more fuel at a discounted price of 3% or less and when it becomes compulsory,they will sell 3% more fuel at NO discount.
Who is in whos pocket??????
From papers I've read, it's a pointless exercise as overall, more energy is used to obtain 1 liter of ethanol than you get from burning it.
To say it's good for the environment is crap. It's pure politics.
The only ones its good for is for those who grow the base stock (sugar cane & wheat primarily) to make the stuff.
Luc
This is correct but so is it correct over the very vast majority of environmental schemes.Originally Posted by Luc
It works if you are a closet fossil fuel hater, if you stand to make money, if you stand to benefit by position.
It also works to take the emphasis from other much more credible projects/understandings that would all on it's own without the above reason benefit all.
BUT
as an alternative it's not actually a problem in any environmental sense especially where trash is used...the entire subject is in good science effectively null.
Either way fossil fuel is a non renewable resource (and not today a real environmental problem in truth ie one that needs to be made amends for into the future) and ethanol has the potential if mismanaged to starve children.
Much more than this above will be localised and if not localised pretty much the end of the entire issue on a 1st world level, unless...see paragraph one again.
Political misinformation and position holding are one thing.
Getting a product available for boaties and other similar interested parties that cannot use biofuels is another.
Sugarcane and wheat based ethanol will soon disappear as local production methods, as worldwide science advancements have already taken over ethanol science to produce much lower cost based, volume commodity production of biofuels - particularly ethanol. The current production cost of biomass produced ethanol offshore is down to around 22c per litre but guess where the difference will go by the time it gets imported to Australia in volume and inflated back to 'normal' pump prices?
Our domestic ethanol production industry will be stuffed (but then it could never fuel enough cars anyway) and the politicians will have another problem to solve as domestic sugarcane based ethanol becomes unsellable.
Shame really, but then the Qld govt had a chance to invest in the new technology 5 years ago and declined "in case it upset the sugar cane farmers and lost votes". Within two years from now it will be back to haunt them although unfortunately E20 will be a worldwide reality.
Now we need to address how to get our boat engines to work!
Cheers
Plato
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