Gut and Gill comps should be banned!

[poddy mullet]

Sorry guys, I just wanna clear up that this post was intended for freshwater impoundment comps, but it sure is interesting to hear ideas on salt water comps as well.

I just feel that encouraging everyone to pull out the freshwater breedstock to win a prize is not what we are trying to acheive. If you want a feed, take a good pan size one. Its much like taking a "yearling" steer- the meat is much better! Let the big breeders go for the sake of the future! Take a photo and frame it-it will last much longer then the after tatse. Matt

[banshee]

..........I just feel that encouraging everyone to pull out the freshwater breedstock to win a prize is not what we are trying to acheive.........[/INDENT]

The thing is that apart from Saratoga and on rare occasions when conditions are perfect,Cod,I cant think of a targeted species that can breed in a dam.I'm not a fan of concentrating large numbers of anglers in any given spot for the purpose of catching fish, but if your going to do it a stocked impoundment is probably the best place ,after all they are put there to reduce pressure on wild stocks.

[poddy mullet]

They may only breed in some circumstances in impoundments, but what stops the breed stock travelling up the river arm to spawn/breed, before returning to the impoundment? Matt

[banshee]

Which species of fish or comps are we talking about?

[aussiebasser]

For Bass and Barra, a bloody great concrete wall slows them down a bit. For Yella's and Silvers, in most Queensland dams they don't occur naturally anyway. Even those areas where they did appear naturally, there is a pretty good stocking scheme to keep the numbers up. You may want to read what I posted on Sweetwater about Catch and Release fishing being banned in some European countries. Trying to ban fishing for a feed will be playing straight in to PETA's hand. NSW could be a different issue, your licence fee down there just goes into gubberment coffers, up here most of it goes back to community stocking groups. Set you aim higher, don't hit at the people catching fish, hit at your gubberment to change their priorities and put your licence money to good use, not just to bolster their superannuation. Wasting money on a feral species like trout could be a good place to start your argument with them. If somebody came up with the idea now, to import a species and stock it in our waters when it has to ability to breed and compete with native species they'd be laughed out of existence, and yet, your gubberment promotes this environmental vandalism.

[banshee]

................. NSW could be a different issue, your licence fee down there just goes into gubberment coffers..............

Not really,the amount used for admin out of the rec license revenue is caped at 10%,the other 90% is distributed by a board consisting of people elected by anglers.This system is not perfect by any means but is a lot better than other states who I believe lose all the money to consolidated revenue.

[leelee]

Whilst I find it hard to kill a fresh water fish, we must remember that almost all impoundment fish do not occure within that dam naturally. They have been placed there for either recreational and or scientific purposes and the later being the major reason.

Majority of the dams surrounding surrounding Brisbane have healthy populations but the reason they have fish swiming in them is because SEQ does tests on a regualr basis by electro fishing and killing the fish to find out the toxic conent and heavy metals etc present within the fish, which would then indicate problems within the water. The fish have been placed there to be indicators for this so please don't kid yourself to think they have been stocked purely for a recreational purpose.

With no predators present, who culls the fish from dams?

Lots of the locals that live around impoundments take a feed of fish as that is all they can get that is fresh so to speak.

Cheers

Lee

[NAGG]

In this day & age (digital cameras) - do we really need gut & gill comps

Chris

[Mike Delisser]

Whilst I find it hard to kill a fresh water fish, we must remember that almost all impoundment fish do not occure within that dam naturally. They have been placed there for either recreational and or scientific purposes and the later being the major reason.

Majority of the dams surrounding surrounding Brisbane have healthy populations but the reason they have fish swiming in them is because SEQ does tests on a regualr basis by electro fishing and killing the fish to find out the toxic conent and heavy metals etc present within the fish, which would then indicate problems within the water. The fish have been placed there to be indicators for this so please don't kid yourself to think they have been stocked purely for a recreational purpose.

Cheers

Lee

??? News to me, how come it's so hard to get permission to start stocking an impoundment then? I'd like to hear Dale's or Fitzy's take.

As for catch n kill comps V live weigh in and release, well there's already a rating system for comps. Best is the photo/brag mat n release, then livewell, & last of course is dead weigh in. Hopefuly this system can be used more and anglers will start looking into it before they enter a comp, if the issue is important to them. At least the angler will be making an informed decision.
I fish about 12 (livewell) bass comps and a few barra (photo) comps each year and I wouldn't have kept a freshwater fish for 8 years, but I would'nt want to see the end of catch n kill comps in put n take fisheries. The old Kirkleagh comp was mainly catch n kil (esp the early years) but even though a lot of fish were killed, the stocking group that ran it raised enough money to put a shitloads more fingerlings back in the dam. Nothing wrong with that in my books, it's a put n take fishery that is maintained by the local stocking group. So long as bag limits are observed and everyone has a SIP, I recon the stocking group should be envolved or at least benefit.
Also I wouldn't assume that 100% of fish that spend a few hours in a livewell live a long and healthy life, esp in summer.
Cheers
Mike

Edit
I haven't looked at their website yet but I just grabbed this off Wik.

In recent times, concern regarding the potential for large fishing tournaments to have impacts on the environment and fish stocks has lead to the development of an environmental standard for fishing tournaments. NEATFish[7] (a National Environmental Assessment of Tournament Fishing) is an environmental standard designed in Australia for rating fishing tournaments with a 1 to 5 star rating system. The standard is based on a questionnaire that is available online at www.neatfish.com. Tournament organisers can use the website to evaluate their tournaments environmental performance as well as social and economic aspects.

[Charlie]

Sorry guys, I just wanna clear up that this post was intended for freshwater impoundment comps, but it sure is interesting to hear ideas on salt water comps as well.

I just feel that encouraging everyone to pull out the freshwater breedstock to win a prize is not what we are trying to acheive. If you want a feed, take a good pan size one. Its much like taking a "yearling" steer- the meat is much better! Let the big breeders go for the sake of the future! Take a photo and frame it-it will last much longer then the after tatse. Matt

I'm fifty and have fished Wyangala for over forty years and trust me 99.9999999999% of the fish are stocked on a put and take basis,overall I don't believe one comp in wintertime has too much effect.

[aussiebasser]

In certain areas I'm sure SEQ Water use fish for water quality testing. In our stocked impoundments the stocking and most of the research is supervised out by DEEDI, I think the Scientific Research argument is a bit of a conspiracy theory. Having been involved with SWFSA for close to 10 years, I've never heard this discussed. We'll have over $100,000 this year to spend on Fingerlings. I don't think they'd need to spend that much just to do some research, although the Japanese spend more than that "researching " whales. There are no regulations covering fishing competitions that are enforceable. Anybody can front up at a Qld dam and run a catch and kill comp. As long as competitors don't have more than their legal limit in their possession they're not breaking a law. You can catch your bag, kill them, weigh them, throw them in the community rubbish bin and go out and do it all over again, Bass, Yella's, Silvers, Barra you name it. I don't advocate that, but preaching to sportsfishermen that it's wrong is like teaching Grandma to suck eggs. You have to set your sights on the authorities.

[leelee]

??? News to me, how come it's so hard to get permission to start stocking an impoundment then? I'd like to hear Dale's or Fitzy's take.

As for catch n kill comps V live weigh in and release, well there's already a rating system for comps. Best is the photo/brag mat n release, then livewell, & last of course is dead weigh in. Hopefuly this system can be used more and anglers will start looking into it before they enter a comp, if the issue is important to them. At least the angler will be making an informed decision.
I fish about 12 (livewell) bass comps and a few barra (photo) comps each year and I wouldn't have kept a freshwater fish for 8 years, but I would'nt want to see the end of catch n kill comps in put n take fisheries. The old Kirkleagh comp was mainly catch n kil (esp the early years) but even though a lot of fish were killed, the stocking group that ran it raised enough money to put a shitloads more fingerlings back in the dam. Nothing wrong with that in my books, it's a put n take fishery that is maintained by the local stocking group.
Also I wouldn't assume that 100% of fish that spend a few hours in a livewell live a long and healthy life, esp in summer.
Cheers
Mike

Edit
I haven't looked at their website yet but I just grabbed this off the net.

In recent times, concern regarding the potential for large fishing tournaments to have impacts on the environment and fish stocks has lead to the development of an environmental standard for fishing tournaments. NEATFish[7] (a National Environmental Assessment of Tournament Fishing) is an environmental standard designed in Australia for rating fishing tournaments with a 1 to 5 star rating system. The standard is based on a questionnaire that is available online at www.neatfish.com. Tournament organisers can use the website to evaluate their tournaments environmental performance as well as social and economic aspects.

Mike not sure what I am missing here but I have spoken to a few SEQ water guys and for instance the bass that are placed in North Pine are tested on a regular basis as are a few other dams.

Whilst I agree with Dale about it being a consipiracy theory, the logic surrounding why fish are places within our drinking water is sound. If heavy metals are found within the flesh of the fish from that dam, then the treatment of that water needs to be altered to minimise the effect it can have on us.

I don't understand the reference you made to stocking a dam either sorry?

Cheers

Lee

[Mike Delisser]

I don't understand the reference you made to stocking a dam either sorry?

Cheers

Lee

Hi Lee, I just don't think the major reason we are permited to stock dams is so water quality can be monitored, particularly as it's so hard to get the permision to commence a stocking program in the first place, hence that reference.

While I don't doubt heavy metals would show up in fish if present, I've been out netting once with a scientist (Dave Roberts?) at Nth Pine before, he said they're not looking at too many dams at all and there's over 30 on the SIP scheme alone and he didn't mention heavy metals. I would expect that if testing water quality was the major reason fish stocking was permitted the testing would be more wide spread and more regular that it is now. It would only be a guess but I recon a species that sits and feeds on the bottom like jewies could be a better tester for heavy metals anyway, or maybe the silt. That's just my take on it all though.
Cheers

[aussiebasser]

By the time the heavy metals show up in the Bass, it'll be too late for the Pine Rivers people. Water tests are carried out on the water. As I said, SEQWater and DEEDI have different agenda's. SEQWater own the dam, but not the fish in them. They don't set bag limits, stocking rates, size limits or license requirements for fishing. Your SEQWater permit only allows you to put you vessel on the water. It does not allow you to fish. That's all done by DEEDI. You do not need either to give permission to run a competition in Queensland.

[PinHead]

I was thinking along those lines also Dale..by the time the fish has the heavy metals in it, gets caught and tested,,the heavy metals are already in the drinking water. As for the comps..as long as the competitor abides by the comp rules and the relevant State Legislation then all is good...if you don't like the way a comp is conducted then don't enter it.