Bragging - Giving away secrets

[Horse]

Skipper, you have given me a great idea. I start posting fictitious reports about the Barwons and take all the pressure off my grounds off Moreton:rolleyes: .

If you think a few reports are going to make any significant change in the number of fishos hitting your particular spots then think again. People fish areas that they can easily access. The improvement in the roads is the biggest reason for areas like 1770 being more popular. If you give away your particular spot then its your own fault but I am happy to give info to help another rec fisho get a feed and enjoy fishing as a pastime.

I don't think this has anything to do with a rec v pro arguement. It seems more like an indevidual who thinks they own a section of water when in reality its all shared ground where we chase a commonly owned resource and as long as a little common courtesy is shown I have no issue with it

[charleville]

Skipper i dont think you really need to worry i no of a lot of guy's that are amateur's that come back with very little for there efforts, i think that if you where to sit at the ramp on those busy weekends and ask the guy's coming in how they went you would be surprised at actually how many catch fish because a fair old amount of them just can't fish,

Ain’t that the truth! It is interesting to read the comments to my sticky thread in the Saltwater Chat section giving general tips on being a bait fisho, plus the PMs that I have received likewise, to see that there are a lot of people who go fishing and are always disappointed at the end of each and every outing. Maybe that is why we see so many boats sitting in yards year in and year out, all covered up, and which never seem to move from the same position.

Remember when Foggy and Aquarius started fishing Mud with plastics , with in 6 months it got very very popular. Look at all the guys chasing Threadies in the river 5 years ago very few were doing it, now it's very very popular , articals in bush&beach , modern fishing and on here must have an effect on the fishery.

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I reckon that Smithy is spot on about improved motors, and gps are having an effect but I dont think it's a very long bow at all to say that a few good reports from an area will draw fisho to that area !

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I still think you should post reports but i also think you would be naive to assume that people will not notice and want to try these areas themselves! It is after all a free world but i do get what skipper 07 was trying to say!

I agree with all of that also. I have been having the same thoughts. Affordable technology has made it incredibly easy for the average mug to put himself right on top of any spot that he has GPS marks for. Likewise, modern sounders take all of the guesswork away. When I first showed my wife what a sounder would do, her comment was, “Poor fish. They don’t have a chance.” My response though was that "seeing them is not the same as catching them."


Likewise, when we turn up at the fishing seminars at boat shows and the like, we expect to see the expert speakers show some spots on maps as part of their presentations. We expect it and most times they deliver.

Shoot me down in flames if you want, but the best thing the Government ever done to try and preserve fish stocks was to introduce Green Zones.

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The studies on current Green Zones have beyond doubt proven that fish stocks have recovered in all areas that are fished around the green zones including other reefs nearby.

That is not a popular thing to admit to on Ausfish but I have to say that I have never been a staunch opponent to Green zones either. I can see the logic for them when so much more is stacked against the fish with technology and modern mass communications methods (including the internet) and very affordable go-anywhere boats than was ever the case even twenty years ago.

My biggest concern is that some of the Green Zones are a bit hard to identify when on the water even with GPS technology.

If the government sinks a few more Tiwi Pearls around the place to help create opportunities for the amateur to catch a few fish then, I can live with Green Zones.



For me, the pastime of fishing is about the challenge of the hunt for fish, not about the harvesting of them.

However, to say in a report that fish were caught at Mud Island gives pretty well nothing away, IMHO, as there is a lot of water around Mud Island. Likewise, I would that thought that it would be the same in saying something as vague as that fish have been caught at 1770.


Perhaps, skipper07 is merely saying that we ought to be a little circumspect in the detail of the exact location that we report in the reports section and I really don’t have a problem with that.

I reiterate that the pastime of fishing is about the challenge of the hunt for fish, not about the harvesting of them.



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[ShaneC]

I too understand what Skip is trying to say, maybe it could have been put slightly differently, but thats the beauty of internet, emails, and texts...because its an impersonal way of communicating people can take what is being said any number of ways.

For my part, I dont post reports for a number of reasons. I spend the cash, do the km's and put in the effort for the fish I catch but I dont see the need to brag on the net and tell people the wheres/ whens/ hows etc, nobody told me, I spend the cash, take the time and work things out for myself. Secondly I know for a fact that there are other inspired and passionate people out there that also trawl fishing websites in an effort to gather information that will no doubt eventually be used against us and I for one am not going to give em any more ammo than they already have.

I am not having a dig at anyone here, but I also think we should keep our support of green zones to ourselves. I went to the launch of "The End Of The Line" a couple of weeks ago and I had the pleasure of listening to 150 inspired hippies that want nothing more than for fishing to be banned entirely. When I posed the question to Geneivieve Quirk (the Greenpeace activist) and the other chick from the Australian Marine Conservation Society about their proposed closure of the Coral Sea and how it would affect commercial and reco fishing they both stated that the closure had the "overwhelming support" of commercial and recreational fishos alike which we all know is utter bullshit. And I suggest that publicly endorsing the Green Zones already implemented (right or wrong as they may be) would add fuel to their fire so they can manipulate what is being said to ultimately suit their goal.

Now I am not saying for a second that blokes should not post reports and be proud of their achievements but we should also remember that photos of good captures will in some way aid the argument that the greenies have that fish stocks will be exhausted by 2048 and all fishing should be banned yesterday. Most of my marks are too far away from the ramp for most fishos, I dont care if they know the area I fish, they've still got to get there and know how to fish it to come up trumps, but i prefer to keep these things to myself and a few mates that fish with me, which why I think we always come home with a feed.

All of this is in my humble opinion only, I am not having a dig at anyone in any way, but just offering things from another perspective.

Cheers,

Shane

[bbss]

I agree with skipper07. For years i have taken people out snapper fishing from mooloolaba and shown them how i do it and given gps marks. I have learned to be alot more selective with who i help out because more often than not you get shit on. The problem i have is with people not respecting each other on the water. It seems a lot of the weekend warriors think it is ok to pull up and drift right next to a anchored boat 50km offshore just because they saw you catching fish only to motor back and forth through your berley trail and effectively shut down your bite then when they catch nothing take off. This seems to happen to much as areas get busier. The sad part is the spot is often nothing special but they seem to think they have to be on top of you instead of learning the correct technique which is just as importent as location. Anyway thats my 2 cents worth. Respect each other out there and keep it fun.

[hungry6]

LOL, When I first saw this thread, I was um and arring about leting it rip, but it does seem, I'm not in the minority here, The last trip we did up 1770 and surround, we would have spend around $5000 between the 8 of us for the 10 days trip. We took home 11 reds and a couple of snap, that to me equate to around $450 a fish. The main agenda of that trip wasn't about bring the maximun possible amount of fish home, but more of an experience in an area we never fish before amd more stories so we can stretch the truth next time we spoke of the trip. I believe alot of the people who visit such place similar to the users of this forum, are there for the experience and if the fishing is good, then it's a bonus. But to say rec. fishos are depleting fish stock of an area is drawing such a long bow, that it is hard to phatom.
To me and alot of the fellow scientist I deals with agree with, the one single factor that has a very signficant impact on fish stock is "Water quality"
One bad run out of polutted water can wipe out the total number of frys of many fish species in that area, and the effects would not be known until years later.
So basically, cutting it short, I think you're barking up the wrong tree, and it is the same tree that has been propagated by the current labour/green movement.

[rando]

Skip07
Please don't use the "hoops we have to jump through" argument to justify your position. After all, that is the commercial decision you take when deciding the cost /benefit equation of your profession.

Whether amateur or commercial we all have to make a cost benefit decision for each trip.

my 2cents worth

Rando

[Damian Loosemore]

i wonder what responce would have been if he didnt say he was a pro.dont class all pro fisherman the same there many different forms.what he said is right on the mark, what i understand more boats less fish,he suggesting a bit of repect to other fisherman .he didnt say dont help out or whinging just stating the obvious.

[Spot82]

Well since this post was aimed at me in a sense I guess I should post a response.....

I have been fishing for many years, since I was able to walk basically, and in that 25 or so years a lot has changed. Growing up in Hervey Bay you used to be able to always go out and catch a feed of fish be it whiting in close or reefies up at Rooneys. From my experience as others have mentions commercial fishing (netting) of important fisheries like the Sandy Straights has all but ruined them, as well as the Mackerel fishing in the Bay. We used to be able to drive into acres of Mackerel in Wathumba and they would just swim around the boat, now you can't get anywhere near a school of Mackerel before they go deep, all because they were netted so much only to be sold for a couple of dollars a kg.

Is it fair to state your monetary gain from commercial fishing is more important than the enjoyment and lifetime memories that a recreational fisherman gets from catching fish??? I hardly think so....

As others have also said there is 1000's of square kilometres of water from any single boat ramp that can be fished, the fact that I and other are stupid enough to be willing to undertake a 7-8hr drive on very average roads to put in a few days fishing doesn't mean that everyman and his dog will do the same. Most people think I am crazy when I tell them how many hours travel are involved and how much travel we do on the water. And as many others have said a lot of people go up there and come back with very little in their eskies, a) because they don't know how to fish and b) because it takes a lot of time and travel to get to know how and where to fish in various areas. Every trip we find new ground, and typically we would take no more than 5 or 6 reds from any one spot before moving on, hardly devastating the fishery! I am sure a pro would do the same wouldn't they??????? I could almost guarantee that of the 50 boats or more that were out off 1770 the last weekend I was there, there would have been very few that bagged out on reef fish, let alone reds. The fishery off DI and Fraser Island would be much the same. I don’t go to bag out every trip but I do want to catch a decent feed from my family and relatives and to justify spending $1000 a trip without boat and vehicle maintenance costs.

In addition the majority of rec fishos are only able to fish weekends due to work and typically the weather will not play the game! I typically only get one trip a month so when I get the chance I like to make the most of it, this is not a crime...

It might seem like Vertico, Reefmaster, Foxy and myself just go out and clean up without very little effort every trip, but if any "normal" fisho come along they would realise how much time, effort and money it takes to be able to catch such fish. And I think the reason we put posts on here is not to get a pat on the back, but rather help other people have such enjoyment on the water. Recreational fishing puts a lot of money into the economy for the amount of "return" ie landed fish. Last trip I put one of my good mates on to his first red, and that was a huge buzz to share something with someone else, and that was more a sharing of technique than oh here is a spot, catch a red.

I don't share marks or specific areas where I fish on here, but have happily helped everyone who has asked about technique, rigs, bait, etc, I do this because hopefully one day those people can enjoy the feeling of catching that prize fish, this is the feeling that keeps you trying and trying and trying all the time providing a relaxing and enjoyable pastime.

I have no issue with green zones as long as they don't close a whole area, ie what they may be proposing off Fraser Island, What they have done on the GBR is a great approach to management of this important ecosystem, which still allows use of the area while being conscious of trying to maintain health and viability of the area. I would like to see less netting of estuary areas and certain inshore areas to help revive fish stocks in these areas as netting has no regard for the environment. In addition the government should be creating more artificial reefs to encourage increased fish habitats and breeding areas. The areas of Moreton Bay and Hervey Bay are a vast desert of sandy bottom with a few reefy areas which are hit hard by fishing of all types, by increasing the amount of structure for fish to inhabit you decrease the pressure on any one area while providing increased habitat, it’s not rocket science!

I too am fed up with amateur fisho’s who will come and fish right on top of you, this has happened for years and will continue to happen, I am sure it is probably worse when you have yellow numbers on the side of your boat. Even if someone is fishing one a mark I was wanting to fish I will keep a couple of hundred meters away and will not drive right on top of them like so many do, typically there is more than one little patch of reef to fish in the area. Hervey Bay is notorious for this, yet those people still don’t manage to catch anything!

I agree with some of what you are saying but in the majority it is a quite hypocritical and generalising statement without having much of a look in the mirror...
That’s my long winded two cents
Anthony

[finding_time]

I really dont get where this PRO v REC sentiment is comming from as i said before i just think he was pointing out that when you post take a little care if you want to protect what your presently enjoying. Lots of poeple watch this site , other fisho's and more importantly ANTI fisho's( eg Greens) I never post the total haul pics by all means post pics of the fish your most proud of , but those pics of 50 fish laying out on a tarp will come back to bite you eventually, both i drawing more poeple to your area and being used as evidence to bolster the misguideds ( greens) opinion that over fishing if alive and well and more areas need to be locked up! I'll bet anything you like that certain organization monitor this site as fishing groups monitor enviromental sites!

I'm a member of a few hunting sites and they learnt long ago that the pictures and reports that get posted can be used against hunters as a group and there very very careful what sort of pics and reports are posted. Fishing is more endangered than hunting ever will be in this country , certain sections of the enviro lobby want all forms of fishing totally banned, be careful.

Ian

[greenie.77]

Hey I'm going to get in on this too......I'm a carpenter and all these diy shows are really making it hard for me. Everyone these days has a hammer and we ALL know where to get Nails from, I think they should only make nails available to licenced tradies so then I too can fluk up my industry then complain about it in 20 years that it's not like it used to be.....boo fuking hoo!!

[greenie.77]

"Leave from Mooloolaba around 40km to fish shallow ground. The closer reefs e.g 12mile, inner & outers and down off caloundra are fishing alot better at present compared to the wide reefs. The current has been running hard earlier in the week."

If you really believe in what you are saying then why are YOU giving out this info??????

TBH, after reading his post here I WOULD be heading wide, go where he said not to???

[skipper07]

Anthony(Spot82) sorry mate, the post was not aimed at you at all, just had to use you as it was at the top of the list of offshore reports. I should have made that clear, sorry mate.

Ian(Finding Time) you are right this has nothing to do with being a Pro v amateurs. It was a post to look after what we all enjoy doing - fishing offshore.

Most Pros that I know are more then helpful, some are arseholes, but if you get shit on enough you will learn to carry a big stick.
Over the years I have supplied amateur fisho's Fuel, current reports, weather reports through the night. I have handed over on 2 occassions my spare anchoring system to others who not been prepared for rough conditions.

I am the same as most of you guys, I pay taxes, I get screwed on high fuel prices, and I work bloody hard for my income.

All I'm saying is let's look after what we have. Nothing wrong with a good pic of a god size Red, snapper Etc Etc but lets not give away that you came home with 50 snapper or the boat floor or tarp loaded with fish.

[Apollo]

Skipper, I can see where you are coming from and perhaps your original post may have been written better. Your last post is probably better on the money. I deal a lot with pros and it is amazing how many are actually members of this site or atleast troll through it from time to time. Intel??

If your point was that we all need to mindful that we don't encourage all and sundry to flog an area that we are doing ok at, then perhaps we should be a bit more careful as to how much bragging we do. Once we brag in such an open forum, then we can't bitch about everyone suddenly turning up to try the area. If this is your point, then I agree.

Steve

[lampuki]

Damian, If Skipper07 left out the fact that he was a pro, my response would have been:
Regarding: "Not meaning to single people out but Posts Like (Spot82 - sorry mate, no harm intended)"
.....
How can you claim not to single people out, but then mention them in your thread??? and use the term "mate" whilst doing so???
I have heard of people being threatened after posting on this site by "locals", and I wonder if that has played a part in them not posting any more?

The fact that skipper07 is a pro:
Skipper07 actually writes relatively well. You preach conservation by limiting detail in posts (which makes some sense, however the areas being discussed range 100's of ks ).....

BUT rightly or wrongly, I cant help but think that this thread is a case of NIMBY! rather than a genuine concern for rec fishos and fish stocks. The title may well have been, "Awesome fishing around Gold Coast - stay there"

[sandbankmagnet]

I recently went to Fraser, as I have done for the last 30 years and whilst I'm not going to tell you exactly where, we caught some really nice sand whiting. 10 foot fast taper rods with 8lb vanish leader, pipis on no 8 circle hooks and small weights. Please don't fish here though, as I've been plenty of times and it is my spot. I'll be pissed if I see someone fishing next time I go to Fraser. Woops. I mean Moreton. D'OH I mean Inala. West Inala. No sorry I can't be that specific. Inala.... Inala-ish. And when I say Inala, I definitely don't mean Fraser. Stay away from Fraser.