Rock fishing legislation

[NAGG]

But Chris it isn't the fisherman dying it is the people that do this infrequently I thought . if that is the case then grapevines won't help

Apparently the group of 5 that went in off Catherine Hill Bay were relatively experienced & familiar with the area .......... I saw an interview with a local rock fishoe that knew them.

But agree ..... Its the migrant ( middle east / Asian) that are often the ones that loose their life....... often they can't swim and dress inappropriately

Chris

[finga]

You also have to remember that some nationalities do not cherish a person's life like most of us do.
Maybe that's why they risk a life or so for the possibility to catch a fish??

[NAGG]

You also have to remember that some nationalities do not cherish a person's life like most of us do.
Maybe that's why they risk a life or so for the possibility to catch a fish??

you're kidding aren't you :huh:

[finga]

you're kidding aren't you :huh:

Nope. Just look at the cultures (usually cultures that suffer from severe poverty) where lots of children are born so that one day one or two will survive to look after the parents.
There are reasons for the figures shown on the map in this link.
http://www.nationmaster.com/red/grap...y-rate&b_map=1
Some cultures do not like females to be born.
http://www.futurepundit.com/archives/006007.html
http://paa2006.princeton.edu/downloa...issionId=60960
And a lot of cultures/religions have females treated very differently to the males
http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/o...ains_stil.html

And it goes to the other extreme where cultures take their departed (dead) family with them when they move because they think of them as still part of the family. (some North American cultures)

There is a huge myriad of cultural differences out there. We cannot, and should not, compare one belief against what we believe in.

Here's a quote that may shock ""For this land which you now inhabit, shut in on all sides by the sea and the mountain peaks, is too narrow for your large population; it scarcely furnishes food enough for its cultivators. Hence it is that you murder and devour one another, that you wage wars, and that many among you perish in civil strife". That quote was from the tongue of a Pope. Pope Urban II. Granted it was a while ago (1095) but shows how cultures do change and how their attitude towards death also changes.

[deepfried]

finga you completely lost me with that last post and what are you on about. none of that has anything to do with deaths rock fishing or a reason behind it.

[finga]

Just trying to explain how different cultures value life (and death) and even different genders differently.
It might explain why people from certain backgrounds would take more risks to catch a fish then you and I would.
But it looks like I failed dismally. Sorry about that.

A good example would be...would you set out to sea in an Indonesian fishing boat??
I wouldn't.

[NAGG]

finga you completely lost me with that last post and what are you on about. none of that has anything to do with deaths rock fishing or a reason behind it.

I felt exactly the same !

I seriously doubt that anyone ventures onto the rocks with a mindset that if I die - big deal ........ families are still devastated by the loss - & there is no 70 virgins on offer just a potential feed of fish.

As for fishing out of those Indonesian fishing boats - that's what they have - & they probably look at us funny when we go up in an plane & jump out with just a piece of cloth

I dont think we should assume that asians / middle easterns value their life any less than us

Chris

[finga]

Would it have been better to say some cultures are prepared to take more risks to get a feed then what a majority of 5th generation Australians are prepared to take??

[TimiBoy]

Would it have been better to say some cultures are prepared to take more risks to get a feed then what a majority of 5th generation Australians are prepared to take??

I followed you Finga.

The idea of life being treasured in this context is about being prepared to take a risk to achieve result "X". Finga is spot on in that regard, there are cultures which appear to be happy with risks with which we generally don't bandy, and vice-versa.

How does one explain that the majority of recent deaths in NSW are of Asians? Possibilities:

- a gazillion more Asians rock fish. (A logical conclusion but I don't know the numbers)
- Asians have been unlucky (ridiculous)
- Asians will generally take a greater risk to catch fish. (A logical conclusion?)

Note that none of these possibilities is suggestive of racism, just a recognition that cultures differ.

Cheers,

Tim

[NAGG]

Would it have been better to say some cultures are prepared to take more risks to get a feed then what a majority of 5th generation Australians are prepared to take??

Is it because we live in close proximity to the ocean & have greater respect for it ? (we also teach our children to swim)
I doubt too many people from the Middle East would see too much in the way of big waves - the same goes for China , Vietnam , Cambodia etc ..... their lack of exposure just may be the problem .
The same goes for tourists drowning on our beaches - ( lack of familiarity) , 4WD Crashes on Fraser Is - no experience & familiarity

Chris

[NAGG]

I followed you Finga.

The idea of life being treasured in this context is about being prepared to take a risk to achieve result "X". Finga is spot on in that regard, there are cultures which appear to be happy with risks with which we generally don't bandy, and vice-versa.

How does one explain that the majority of recent deaths in NSW are of Asians? Possibilities:

- a gazillion more Asians rock fish. (A logical conclusion but I don't know the numbers)
- Asians have been unlucky (ridiculous)
- Asians will generally take a greater risk to catch fish. (A logical conclusion?)

Note that none of these possibilities is suggestive of racism, just a recognition that cultures differ.

Cheers,

Tim

Hi Tim

There is no doubt that there are more Asians hitting the rocks for a fish ...... During my rock fishing days of the mid 80's to mid 90's it was fairly rare to see them at the many locations that I fished ........ Most were anglo saxon / European ..... particularly LBG or ludderick/drummer fisherman - lots of experienced anglers. But toward the mid 90's more & more we would see middle eastern & a trickle of asians hitting the rocks .... but most stuck to the road bridges , jetties & rivers.
Today ....... and this is something that I never saw ...... They fish the rocks & bring the family too .... I think the last major loss of life was a family group washed in at the Kiama point 20 years ago - & from memory they were from the ME.

[deepfried]

Chris,
I read that report that you posted a link to and it has some interesting findings. With the bulk of the deaths occuring on known ledges and during certain sea conditions it may be easier to just close those ledges on days like those and concentrate policing on those days. It wont stop every death but there are risks in everything we do but it would reduce them very quickly. I also dont think it would piss of the experienced fishos that avoid those conditions knowing how dangerous they are.

[banshee]

Chris,
I read that report that you posted a link to and it has some interesting findings. With the bulk of the deaths occuring on known ledges and during certain sea conditions it may be easier to just close those ledges on days like those and concentrate policing on those days. It wont stop every death but there are risks in everything we do but it would reduce them very quickly. I also dont think it would piss of the experienced fishos that avoid those conditions knowing how dangerous they are.

What a nightmare,closures for certain areas under certain conditions and what if,heaven forbid,the weather mob gets the forecast wrong and we are in a position of being fined for wanting to fish a perfectly safe location......not to mention that you are still trying to save me from myself.....something that I resent after thirty three years of rock hopping.
Also noted that Kiama point was mentioned,there are a multitude of signs in every conceivable language known to man posted on that point and they (the idiots) still choose to ignore them and risk life and limb,that's more than enough legislation I think.

[Blusta]

Just because it is a law doesn't mean it will be followed or regularly checked by those in power. Just more legislation...

[Jurkyjj]

I would have to say yes for the simple reason......if 1 life can be saved......then it is worth it.
BUT.....commonsense must also play a part.

jason.