Optimax & E-Tec Outboards

[Jabba_]

Matt, Do you think this is the reason why the E-Tecs are going thru injectors ?

Daz

Not sure why the E-tec injector has been a pain in BRP's arse, my guess its the quality off the componants that make up the injector... I have been sticking it up them at the Owners site, near got myself banned...

Earlier models seem to be more prone to dropping an injector..
08, BRP came out with the new BIP injector and had a few teething problems, since then, the injectors seem to be going great.. I have not heard off any 09 model E-tec's having a injector problem that was not water or dirty fuel related...

regards to water, I know the guys down at Broadwater boating very well, there Yammie dealers... If you get water through there injectors, you'll suffer the same fate as the E-tec's injectors....

Yammie runs very small injectors and does not tolerate water very well.. Condensation or phase separation in a Yamaha usually it means all new injectors and a fuel system.... That if the water makes it up to the injector...

Not sure how the other manufacturers cope with small quantities off water..

Just do your best to avoid getting water in your fuel lines...

[wrxhoon]

I have a 200 Opti in my Trophy and she has never missed a beat , excellent in fuel as well . The boat weighs around the 2200 -2500 kg with fuel, gear and 3-4 blokes and I average .9 mile per lt. I spin a 18" pitch Enertia prop, I had a 19" vengance and I'm going to try a 19" Vensura soon .

As others said they are both good engines, E-tech a little quiter and I haven't found the Opti to smell any more that e-tech. Opti will use a little less fuel though.
Depending on RPM she will use even less that 4 strokes, trolling at 600rpm I use 1.4 lts per hour. Don't forget none of the 4 strokes are DI yet, all cars are going DI now.

As others said E-tech uses very high pressure ( not in the fuel lines of course, you couldn't get an electric fuel pump to pump that high) but the injector itself. Opti Uses the orbital engine set up with a compressor .
I have seen compessors fail in high hour engines, well over 1000, in USA and if it fails it will take the engine with it .

The 4 stroke brigade will tell you to go 4 stroke, I wouldn't unless you use it very regularly and do lots of hours at mid RPM, say 4000, thats when you will get the most out of a 4 banger but don't forget they make their power very high in the rev range so you need a bigger HP engine .

Good luck with whatever you choose.

[Jabba_]

( not in the fuel lines of course, you couldn't get an electric fuel pump to pump that high) but the injector itself. Opti Uses the orbital engine set up with a compressor ..

Actually you can get a pump to pressurize fuel much higher then 700psi...
All these new Common Rail turbo diesel motors run between 20'000psi and 40'000psi through the fuel line...

The D40 Navara run at 25'000psi... Hence why a fuel filter cost $180 and needs to be calibrated by Nissan for an extra $90...

Don't go feeling around for a diesel leak with your hands, you may end up loosing your fingers

[ozscott]

Not sure why the E-tec injector has been a pain in BRP's arse, my guess its the quality off the componants that make up the injector... I have been sticking it up them at the Owners site, near got myself banned...

Earlier models seem to be more prone to dropping an injector..
08, BRP came out with the new BIP injector and had a few teething problems, since then, the injectors seem to be going great.. I have not heard off any 09 model E-tec's having a injector problem that was not water or dirty fuel related...

regards to water, I know the guys down at Broadwater boating very well, there Yammie dealers... If you get water through there injectors, you'll suffer the same fate as the E-tec's injectors....

Yammie runs very small injectors and does not tolerate water very well.. Condensation or phase separation in a Yamaha usually it means all new injectors and a fuel system.... That if the water makes it up to the injector...

Not sure how the other manufacturers cope with small quantities off water..

Just do your best to avoid getting water in your fuel lines...

MAN....this is the problem with people whose boats sit around in the weather for a while before using...like mine...I have a good seperator and filter and use fuel stabiliser, and also run my bowls dry, but the worst I can do is get gunk in the carbs/varnish and strip them down and clean them (which if paid for is still only about $200 in labour and gaskets)....I would like to know the cost for a new injector for ETEC not covered by warranty and new injectors and rails etc for Yammy not covered by warranty!!!!! This could get seriously out of hand for a rec boatie!

How do the opti's handle gunk/water in the fuel?

Cheers

[Noelm]

I don't think any injector likes water/dirt in the fuel, doesn't matter whether it be an Opti or a diesel or anything else, the "holes" are so small that they get damaged or buggered by water quite easily, for that matter, carbies are not all that happy about water either.

[ozscott]

I have seen compessors fail in high hour engines, well over 1000, in USA and if it fails it will take the engine with it .

Mate - for my money (and again everyone is different about their needs) I would want to get WAY over 1000 hours before my engine was likely (and I know you are not saying likely - your comment applies no doubt to a small percentage) to go like a grenade. Optis themselves, sans a compressor failure, should see about 4,000 hours without dramas. They do on net boats in only 2-3 years without incident in moreton bay. Perhaps age not just hours is a factor. I know that 1000 hours take years and years for most people to rack up, but for my money I want a motor that is likely to last for 15-20 years without major incident....perhaps when I eventually re-power my Vag when the 115 V4 Yam carb has had enough (and its now 17 years old) I should grab a Yam V6 Carb before they stop making them!!!! Arrgh!!! I was pretty much sold on the Yam 4 stroke or Optimax, but I do worry about out of warranty matters with all these engines....I know many of you might say just buy it and dont worry because its rare etc, but I just cannot justify spending thousands (and if a motor goes pop $15 THOUSAND say) over even 10 years on out of warranty repairs on top of normal servicing costs.

Cheers


Cheers

[Angla]

My 135 Opti has been great till now. Has 430 hours and broke a alternator bolt which I then did another 5 hours of work with crossing the south passage bar 2 1/2 times. Cost me $10.00 to replace the bolt and it shall now be replaced every 100 hours without fail. Thats the whole list of faults.

It does smell a little, at times. It still goes like a rocket.

I did have the mechanic tell me that I had a lot of c#ap in the filter at the last service but I have never heard it miss a beat Ever.

My 2Cents. Look at the opti very closely. I mean go and take the cover off and look at the alternator specifically. I believe they have modified the mounts to eliminate the bolt issue. I have heard Mercury deny there is a problem but why would they then change this.

The only other motor I have owned was a 115 Evinrude Carby job and my opti uses 1/2 the fuel it did.

Cheers
Chris

[Mac_Attack]

Thanks everyone for your feedback its much appreciated, we've decided on the Optimax 150

[cormorant]

How can water get in the system if teh designers have a clue ?

I think a lot of issues with new motors are when they are used on a irregular basis

On test beds even under high load and constant high revs and high acceleration they last.

Fuel quality.

Can't wait for the diesel outboards in high HP.

ETCS ./ Optimax etc should come with 5000 hr warranty , no quibble on injectors / compressor as they should have designed a fuel system to cope with the quality avaliable - fit for service under consumer law - or aren't they . Same goes for all brands


Car manufacturers now 5 years unlimited km warranty on Kia - makes you think

[Jabba_]

How can water get in the system if teh designers have a clue ?

I think a lot of issues with new motors are when they are used on a irregular basis

On test beds even under high load and constant high revs and high acceleration they last.

Fuel quality.

Can't wait for the diesel outboards in high HP.

ETCS ./ Optimax etc should come with 5000 hr warranty , no quibble on injectors / compressor as they should have designed a fuel system to cope with the quality avaliable - fit for service under consumer law - or aren't they . Same goes for all brands


Car manufacturers now 5 years unlimited km warranty on Kia - makes you think

There are 3 possible ways for water to enter the fuel system that I know off..
Condensation
Phase seperation
Leaving the fuel cap off, allowing rain or sea water to enter the tank..

That last one is a doosey... I met a bloke at Hinterland Marine that did just that, lost his cap and still went fishing...
He need to get towed home because water entered his tank and stalled the motor... The Sea water had entered every injector, and slowly each one clapped out over a course off 18months....

I don't think you can blame the injector for failing after it has ingected sea water...

[Jabba_]

MAN....this is the problem with people whose boats sit around in the weather for a while before using...like mine...I have a good seperator and filter and use fuel stabiliser, and also run my bowls dry, but the worst I can do is get gunk in the carbs/varnish and strip them down and clean them (which if paid for is still only about $200 in labour and gaskets)....I would like to know the cost for a new injector for ETEC not covered by warranty and new injectors and rails etc for Yammy not covered by warranty!!!!! This could get seriously out of hand for a rec boatie!

How do the opti's handle gunk/water in the fuel?

Cheers

1 injector on my motor costs $299 + 1hr labour....

extreamly rare that all six injectors would need to be replaced all at once....

[Hell Boy]

1 injector on my motor costs $299 + 1hr labour....

extreamly rare that all six injectors would need to be replaced all at once....

Thats not a bad price for an injector, i was expecting it to be more!!!

Not really really boat related, but engine wise it is. I had all the injectors replaced out of my 07 D4 hilux mid last year and they were a little over $1200 each, so i was told. they were replaced under warranty due to the known injector problem with the Prado's & Hilux's D4 diesel engines at the time. Had to fight for it though....

[Getout]

A mate has an E-tec that he is very frustrated with at the moment.Bought new 2008 in bits near the end of last year.

How so? Can't it be fixed? It would be still under warranty.

[finding_time]

There are 3 possible ways for water to enter the fuel system that I know off..
Condensation
Phase seperation
Leaving the fuel cap off, allowing rain or sea water to enter the tank..

...

Missed one jabba, and it's probably the most common There is water in the fuel when you pumped it in.! Some service stations have old holding tanks and these leak! There is one servos near me that i refuse to fill up at any more, because i have copped a load of water 2 times there, it's just lucky that i always check the water filter after 5 min idling and drain it!

[bigjimg]

How so? Can't it be fixed? It would be still under warranty.

Yes all work has been under warranty.Been pulled apart twice,Injectors playing up,Last one the powerhead was off and were thinking of sending back to States for analysis or something.All back together now with ??? marks over the problems being rectified,some doubt about the computer.Jim