Where have the fish gone?

[Slider]

The short term plan that I have been working on Mac, is to convince the Minister for Environment and Resource Management, that using revenue from vehicle permits to buy back licenses on the North Shore is in her interests.

Lacking suitable terrestrial infrastructure projects to which the minister can direct these funds, the buy back has very few, if any drawbacks for the community as a whole.

The license holders themselves would welcome, and have stated as such, a buy back as diminishing catches are reducing viability.

Rec fishing tourism to the region can flourish due to the certain return of inshore species.

Seabirds such as terns and gannets have greater protection afforded due to improved access to prey - particularly with 'closed beaches at the Noosa Rvr mouth and at some stage, the sthrn end of Fraser designed specifically for the protection of migratory terns under the RAMSAR International Treaty.

Dolphins and loggerhead turtles are a beneficiary of reduced netting as fish eaters. More dolphin sightings, more tourism.

One of the K8 license holders is also an N1 license owner and is one of 2 only licenses permitted to work at Fraser - and nets far more frequently than the other license and therefore reduces fishing effort at Fraser substantially. Again dolphins and loggerheads benefit from reduced netting at Sandy Cape - is a breeding area for loggerheads and is a large population of dolphins to be found there when netting isn't occurring.
Tailor spawning which occurs around the waters of the Great Sandy Spit are uninterrupted by netting at the cape.

Currently, it is proposed that there will be a stretch of beach from the mouth of the Noosa Rvr to Teewah that will be 'permit free'. This stretch of beach would become a madhouse under this plan, but the minister wants to appease the using public by offering a 'free beach'. The using public would be far more accepting of compulsory permits for the entire beach if they could see that their money is going to a situation that improves their recreational abilities. A permit for the entire beach then allows for the entire strategy of declaring Cooloola under RAM in the first place to have some effectiveness - ie reducing and or controlling traffic flow and vehicular and human impact on sensitive sections of beach.


A rec fishing license would certainly be helpful in providing funds for a buy back, but we won't be seeing one in the short term. And with the State unlikely to be willing to fund such a buy back from consolidated revenue, then the likelihood of any cessation of netting in Cooloola soon is nil unless permit revenue is utilised.

Submissions to the minister in response to the release by DERM of the Cooloola Regulatory Impact Statement are due by September 7. If we could get the message to the minister that we as rec fishers are in favour of a buy back using permit revenue, then I am confident that the proposal will at least be considered. Many other submissions from Coastcare groups, wildlife carers, tern and gannet experts and local interest groups will be enhanced greatly by further submissions from the general public proposing the buy back also.

Submissions can be sent to Kate Jones - ccs@ministerial.qld.gov.au


The other people that need to be convinced that this would be a good idea are Fisheries. If there aren't scientists within Fisheries that aren't aware of the circumstances of area abandonment around netting and low population levels, then there is a significant lack of understanding of the resource that they are empowered to manage.
So a ping to Tim Mulherin probably wouldn't hurt either - dpi@ministerial.qld.gov.au

Lindsay

[lampuki]

I just went on a moreton trip. I saw one netter on the second last day I was there....I dont think he had been netting yet as his gear was clean and i had not seen him prior to this. In our group of 10 lads, five tailor were caught over 4 days, of which 3 I landed. This story was echoed across the barge.

The week before, a group landed 300 tailor over a 10 day period fishing the same gutters we were.

Needless to say, we are rethinking our timing.

[Chris Ryan]

The lone amateur who built the Ark conserved all species and survived the trip. The Titanic went down.............

Will join straight away if that will help. I still feel something should be done in the short term.

Exactly my point with that Mac. It means that if an individual takes the time to do something, then it will make a difference for the positive. Sit and let the "professionals" do it and it will head off into cold dark depths of the sea.

As individuals we can join ECOfishers, put your hands up for a job to do and get the word spread that there is a group doing the right things for what we love - recreational fishing. The more individuals we have wanting to help, the larger the group collective voice!

Thanks for saying you are joining up! Welcome.

Cheers,
Chris

[Slider]

But would Ecofishers actually attempt to do anything about netting on the Noosa North Shore and Fraser Island Chris? Or are you just recruiting?
The only approaches I've had from the organisation is asking me to renew a membership that I didn't have with SOBA.

[Chris Ryan]

Of course we will. We work for our members (recreational fisherman) and as this is impacting this area we will make plans and follow them through. Same way we are making plans to monitor the water quality of the Pine River.

Yes we are recruiting because we need feet on the street locally; we need to hear from those in the local area with what the facts of the situation is and what has been done thus far in attempting to get this addressed. Not being from the area and witnessing what is being done day-to-day we would be running blind into the situation and that would be a negative outcome that nobody wants. That goes for any issue (Salt or Fresh) anywhere in QLD, we have to work together.

Cheers,
Chris

[straddie]

Where have the fish gone?

Tailor fishing is a popular sport in Queensland and NSW, and the recreational line fishery has come to dominate the commercial fishery. The number of anglers present on beaches has increased dramatically over the last few decades. Claydon (1996) comments (p. 37), “The picnic is over. … There are ten times more anglers chasing tailor in 1995 than there were in ’75.”

Claydon said that about the 1995 population, do you think the population has increased much in Queensland since then?

[Slider]

And per angler, 10 times as many fish were caught in 1975 as there was in 1995.
That's probably being conservative given the slaughters of the 70s up and down our coastline - pre bag limits and at the height of the club scene where quantity was rewarded with points.

If recs were responsible for population fall, then why are the fish returning to areas in other states where beach netting has been stopped and human/angling populations on the rise.
The return of fish to Sydney Habour is a classic example of why the pros argument of water quality being responsible for pop drops doesn't hold water either.

And we won't go into area abandonment and migration and spawning alts will we Straddie?

[straddie]

Probably best not to, because if you think about it too much it could probably be argued that netting may have saved the tailor stocks from total collapse. If tailor have learned to avoid nets and are caught of a ratio of 5 or 6 to 1 by reccreational anglers then then that might well be all that is saving the species. So area abandonment could well be a good thing.

Over 2 states pros take less than 200 tonne while recs take over 1000 tonne. If pros are scaring the fish away so recs can't catch themm does that mean if the fish are left alone and come into casting range that the pros 200 tonne will be become another 1000 tonne of rec catch? eg 2000 tonne which should be the end of tailor as we know it?

It's a great shame you keep giving people false hope that pros are the reason for tailors decline because the species is in trouble. I would like to see the bag limit brought closer with West Australia of 8 and no more than 2 over 60cm, rather than the proposed increase in size which will only add to the C&R mortality.

Some people think I am a pro lover but when push comes to shove I really only give a rats about the species I love to catch, as you say you do. However you and I are very different in that I do my bit and can count the number of tailor I have caught on one hand this year. We both know tailor isn't a suitable C&R species yet you continue to C&R them in huge numbers. Their extreme C&R mortality rates that could be seeing you personally throwing away (maybe conservative) 500kg to a tonne/year of your discards. Dying and ending up as food for the surf crabs. I would hate to see what you did to a species you didn't like.

[gecho]

i have to admit, i hear of people (Even in this thread) who go out "Expecting" to catch 300 tailor. I thought most rec's were conservative?
I am not one for the pro's however i do believe the finger should be pointed at everyone.

[Chris Ryan]

Well if that is what any investigation shows, then we all all must work together for the benefit of the fishery. There are many parts of this puzzle and each must be looked at on its own merits.

Cheers,
Chris

[Slider]

If the recs were responsible for population drop, then the fish wouldn't be coming back in increasing numbers and size to areas where pros have been banned. If area abandonment isn't causing spawning issues, then why have populations dropped when the fish would be 'safe' if what you say is true? There's a rather large anomaly there.
Therefore, if the fish were to come back with the hypothetical removal of beach hauling, then the results would be the same as the locations where beach hauling has already been banned. ie - they've come back and the recs are obviously not impacting to any population destroying degree despite increased rec pressures where netting has been banned. The proof, quite simply, is in the pudding.

By the same token, I agree that a reduced bag should apply to tailor in Qld waters and the W.A. measures seem suitable to me. Should stocks improve as we would expect them to following a netting ban, then ideally this bag can be increased. Tho we all know that wouldn't happen, it is important to get stocks up quickly and reduced bags assist greatly.

Based on U.S. studies, bluefish mortality rates after c and r are around - what was it Straddie - 40%? So Straddie is inferring that because I catch a few hundred tailor each year and release approx 95% of them that I have killed x kgs of tailor. Whether the percentages outlined in U.S. studies reflect the mortality rate of the fish I'm releasing is a matter that none of us know the answer to - I'm skeptical though. I do know that keeping the fish represents a 100% mortality rate, so I'm doing better than that at least. However, based on 40%, and let's say I catch 500 fish per year and the average weight is 1.5kg. Then that equates to 300kg of dead tailor - and that is erring on the high side on quantity, weight and mortality rates.
At the same time I am causing a hell of a lot of anglers to use metal lures instead of pilchards - which has to be a good thing. And I'm fighting for the alteration of inshore commercial practices more than any other person in Queensland - which would improve all of your fishing. What are you doing about improving the fishery Straddie other than dismiss ideas that have a lot of scientific support and are logical to any thinking person.

I hear Moreton Island is seeing an increase in fish numbers of various species this winter - wonder why this is.

On a side note - until everyone that fishes at Fraser stops using pilchards, then dingo's will forever associate humans with food and the regs that have been put in place, totally pointless.

On another side note Straddie - if I was just interested in selling sliders, why then do I talk about how bad the fishing is here? Surely that would be bad business practice.

[Maso]

just prior to this years rainbow beach fishing classic, we were catching tailor, bream and the odd tarwine from middle rock rite up to the lagoon near DI. Then the local "mullet" pros (who keep telling me that they dont target tailor schools) shot their nets around the coloured sands and the entire strip of beach from mid rock to the lagoon basically just shut down.

have fished the beaches of cooloola for the past 15 years, and its a situation ive seen time and time again. ask any local beach fisho at rainbow and they will tell you the same thing. the same deal along teewah as well.

im always astounded why tailor and dart are netted - given both dont freeze well i can only assume that the majority of the catch ends up as fertilizer or pet food?? if this is the case what a waste of resources.

Maso