ACA C-Tick Approval of VHF Radios

[Simmo2]

This from the ACMA fact sheets.
http://www.acma.gov.au/WEB/STANDARD/pc=PC_1687

Radiocommunications Equipment

The use of non-standard radiocommunications equipment including, but not limited to, cordless phones, land mobile transceivers, CB radios and a range of low power appliances may cause costly interference. Some of the services which may be affected by interference are cellular (mobile) phone services, broadcast radio and television, and two-way radio services, including emergency services.
The use and (sometimes) possession of radiocommunications equipment not specifically designed to comply with Australian standards may be illegal. There are severe penalties for operation, possession for the purpose of operation and supply of radiocommunications equipment that does not comply with applicable Australian standards.
It is illegal to operate any radio transmitter in Australia unless the operation of that transmitter is authorised by a licence issued by ACMA.
Low power transmitters are generally covered by an ACMA radiocommunications class licence. Spectrum usage and equipment standards vary around the world, and it can be difficult to ensure that equipment purchased overseas complies with an ACMA class licence. The operation of most base stations, mobile and handheld transmitters can only be authorised by an apparatus licence, which incurs additional costs.
Two-way base, mobile and handheld equipment other than that used in the amateur service usually requires the assignment of individual operating frequencies. It is most unlikely that this type of equipment, which may be authorised for use in other countries, could be authorised for use in Australia without at least requiring a frequency change, and in many instances cannot be operated at all. As a result, it is generally impractical to bring such equipment into Australia.
As the Australian market for radiocommunications equipment is relatively small compared to the European, US and Asian markets, all of which have different equipment standards and frequency usage regimes, it is not surprising that the vast majority of equipment for sale overseas is unsuitable for use in Australia. The process for having a single piece of radiocommunications equipment tested for compliance to Australian standards is time consuming and expensive. It is generally uneconomic for one-off imports to be tested for compliance.
Radiocommunications equipment approved for use in Australia has the C-Tick label, showing that it meets mandatory technical standards set by ACMA. The C-Tick mark looks like:

[Splash]

Thanks boys!

You all get the TICK of approval!

Splash

[mik01]

yep so all Icom radios are compliant to Aus standards for telecommunication devices and the company itself and its suppliers are c-tick compliant. therefore, the units, whether bought o/s or locally, are ALL the same and therefore compliant for use within Australia.

as mentioned above, it is highly expensive for a company to go through the process of proving their goods are c-tick compliant but that doesn't mean every unit has to be tested and a fee paid for every unit. of course, dealing with a reputable company which is proven compliant is the best course of action.

I see nothing in the above fact sheet, or anywhere on the net that proves otherwise.

[Splash]

Thansk Mik01.

If this is so, would you know why no Austrlian dealers sell the ICOM M504 unit and no American dealers sell the M505 unit?

Basically same unit with some very subtle differences in spec.


Splash

[mik01]

Thansk Mik01.

If this is so, would you know why no Austrlian dealers sell the ICOM M504 unit and no American dealers sell the M505 unit?

Basically same unit with some very subtle differences in spec.


Splash

without being a technical electronics guru, the 505 seems to be tailored towards making the most of the features of the US network - ie more defined frequency range, extra NMEA format etc
interestingly, both have INT formats therefore will both work in Australia.

[TheRealAndy]

Just as a side note, i thought marine frequencies were standard across the world. I think its like aviation, all the frequencies and navigation aids are international, one of the very few places where everything is the same inlcuding measurements! That way if you take off from america, and sail to australia, all your saftey gear will work ok.

[TheRealAndy]

Forgot to add, the US and INT switches, from memory, in the US you are not allowed to transmit on certain marine frequencies, so I assume that the switch prevents you from doing so. They INT switch will allow you to transmit on all frequencies once in internation waters. All this is clearly spelled out in some international standard of which the name escapes me.

[Simmo2]

The table wont post here correctly, but take a look at:
http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/marcomms/apps18.htm

[Splash]

yep so all Icom radios are compliant to Aus standards for telecommunication devices and the company itself and its suppliers are c-tick compliant. therefore, the units, whether bought o/s or locally, are ALL the same and therefore compliant for use within Australia.

as mentioned above, it is highly expensive for a company to go through the process of proving their goods are c-tick compliant but that doesn't mean every unit has to be tested and a fee paid for every unit. of course, dealing with a reputable company which is proven compliant is the best course of action.

I see nothing in the above fact sheet, or anywhere on the net that proves otherwise.

Hi Mik01.

Here is an email from Pat (FishOnMarine) I received yesterday.

".....................I spoke with ICOM America and they said they had never heard of C-Tick and their only concern is their units are FCC approved which is a Federal US approval, so no there is no C-Tick approval. Very interesting information. First time I have seen anything in writing. I have never heard of anyone having issues. My guess it is one of those laws that is virtually impossible to enforce but who knows?"



Q1 - How confident are you with all ICOM radios being compliant for Australia?

Q2 - If FishOnMarine is a supplier of ICOM units, why is he not C-tick compliant then?


Splash

[oddbudman]

Splash,

Why are you so concerned about C-tick compliance with the imported radio?

Does FishOnMarine supply out of the US or Australia?

oddbudman

[mik01]

Hi Mik01.

Here is an email from Pat (FishOnMarine) I received yesterday.

".....................I spoke with ICOM America and they said they had never heard of C-Tick and their only concern is their units are FCC approved which is a Federal US approval, so no there is no C-Tick approval. Very interesting information. First time I have seen anything in writing. I have never heard of anyone having issues. My guess it is one of those laws that is virtually impossible to enforce but who knows?"



Q1 - How confident are you with all ICOM radios being compliant for Australia?

Q2 - If FishOnMarine is a supplier of ICOM units, why is he not C-tick compliant then?


Splash

Splash.... maaaate....
you're missing the point!!!!!

Australia operates its vhf frequencies according to an international standard. We don't have our own standard, nor do we have unique frequencies that no other country uses such as the USA. the units are manufactured in Japan to accommodate such international standards.

if the Icom units were not compliant, then we would have to have specifically made units to suit Australia which would mean we have our own unique vhf operating standard - which we don't. Icom, nor any other manufacturer on the planet, has to specially create a vhf unit just for the Australian market.

your Icom unit, once set to INT mode, will work fine here.

I will not speak for Fishon, out of respect for Pat and the need for this thread to die quickly. You can ask Pat that very question should you feel the need.

One would suspect that c-tick is only required if you are located in Australia and a distributor of electronic equipment. c-tick is an Australian regulation which possibly Icom America have never heard of because they don't manufacture the goods nor distribute to Australia - this is because Icom is Japanese based.

I'm sure if you have any further concerns re Icom's compatibility with the Australian network, you can call Icom Australia directly and they can attest to their compliance with c-tick and the like.

perhaps you might be best to cancel your order with Fishon given you have no confidence in the advice given and puchase directly through Icom Australia and one of their many suppliers? That way, you will not have any fears of persecution from the relevant Australian authorities for your potentially, allegedly, illegal activities while operating such a device.

[Splash]

No probs Mik01 -

Consider thread now dead.

I have thrashed it out enough.....probably too much.

Appreciate your valued input people - has been an interesting read...

Splash

[oldboot]

Just an interesting point.

From the text of the ACMA quote It appears that they have extended the "C Tick" sceme to include radio transmitting aparatus.....the original draft that I read specificlay excluded tansmitting aparatus from the "C tick" sceme and left in place a seperate approvals sceme.


Interesting and logical.

In that case all obligation is placed on the supplier at whatever stage they be.
It is illegal to supply ( import, wholesale, retail) within australia non labeled devices.

excuse me but this is interesting and has far reaching implications.

So if you import an item yourself that isnt labeled and it is found to be radiating spurious....you can be held completely responsible.

If on the other hand it is localy supplied and "C tick" labeled there is very strong responsibility on the supplier.

In the past the user was held 100% responsible for any spurious radiation......It now appears that the supplier is now held at least partly responsible.

I know to many this might seem.... uninteresting but...

This represents a major legal change, radio transmitters now ( it seems) are no longer an item to be operated by technical people but an appliance to be used by consumers.

In my mind there was never a question that the item would work....of course t would.

cheers

[Splash]

Thanks Oldboot.

I too never doubted the item would not work in Oz.

Just curious about what legislation existed and how it was interpreted by a large cross-section of key stakeholders/end users.

Splash

[oldboot]

It is interesting to see what is happening with lots of laws and legselation.

Many times it seems that you are being allowed to do things.......yeh mate you can do that quite legaly...... but if things go wrong.........holy snapping duck $#@t look out.... its all your problem and its all your fault and you will pay.

But we have been seeing the " appliancisisng" of radio equipment for some time.

At one time you had to have a radio officer on a ship & he was a substancialy qualified man ( my fatherinlaw was one) now any grubby seaman with a simple radio ticket is all that is required.

I could go & do LLoyds 1 day course & legaly use the radio on a liner or tanker.

There had to be some slack cut because of the large number of small vessels comming into australian waters with overseas radios on board.

cheers