Seaworthy Cetificates

[seatime]

Some astute observations above, and not such a far fetched idea.
As was mentioned, seaworthiness is covered in existing regulations. It's part of every owner/master/skipper's General Safety Obligation (read "Duty of Care") to ensure their 'ship' is Safe, Properly Equipped & Crewed and Operated in a Safe Manner. That covers it all really, guess it comes down to interpreting the duty of care obligations.
Ensuring a ship (boat,vessel, etc) is Safe, is ensuring it's seaworthiness. It's the operators responsibility.
Whether or not every operator is capable of determining seaworthiness is perhaps another issue.
regards
Steve

[krazyfisher]

i think that would be a great idea for boats but lets not bring extras like jackets into it remember you dont have to sell a boat with them.

[Camo]

Seaworthy certificates, what would be the definition of seaworthy? Would it be that the boat must be able to stay afloat. It couldn't be much more that that because of the vast difference in boat types, uses, and construction. Would a sailboat need one, or a dingy or a rowboat? How about a canoe, would it require one?

With motor vehicles some things are constant, you always have brakes steering seatbelts, tyres etc, which must be checked to pass a roadworthy. For a boat to be safe on the water you don't necessarily need a motor, or steering. Different levels of safety gear are required depending on where you go, smooth water etc. What is the constant across all types of watercraft that must be checked to decide on seaworthiness’? I really don’t think this is a good idea, it just sounds like more bureaucracy and yet another imposition on boat owners.

Camo

[Chimo]

Having a licence to operate a vessel implies, No, imposes a responsibility to ensure safety and seaworthy-ness in the circumstances that the vessel is being used for.

Levels of equipment mandated for different situations are specified and remain the licenced operator's "duty of care".

If you are talking about a certificate of soundness of a vessel, eg is the transom going to fall off due to rot then a buyer would, as he / she is now, be well served to get an inspection from a qualified marine surveyor; this is not the province of a govt department now and why would you choose to make it so?

People do have to be responsible and while caveat emptor no longer strictly applies common sense is a capability that grows with experience and age.

This site is a great example of pooled common sense and experience maturing, being acquired and also being shared. Lets leave govt to what it does best and surveying boats is not it IMHO

Stepping off soap box now; thankyou in anticipation for only throwing soft fruit or tomatoes!

Cheers
Chimo

[seatime]

Seaworthiness has such a wide ranging meaning, or definitions, it would be difficult to place into one written legislated document.
One definition used in maritime law cases is "the vessel is fit to encounter the ordinary perils of the voyage". It generally is left to a court to decide if the ship was seaworthy or not.
Ensuring structural integrity would only be a part of the overall seaworthiness of the vessel. We would be looking along the same lines as commercial survey classifications to implement that kind of standard to recreational vessels.

[PADDLES]

i reckon it's a great idea. you only have to read through the posts on this site to see how many people have been dudded by either a dodgy dealer or a private individual at the point of sale to see that some form of regulation of the boating sales industry is required. it would solve all those trailer weight issues and ensure that boats were sold in a safe, roadworthy and seaworthy condition every time.

[Chimo]

Hi Paddles

So you too think that a person buying a boat; if they feel unsure or are new to the game or have doubts about the seaworthyness / state of the boat traler wts etc should get it checked?

Sounds reasonable to me too especially if the potoential buyer employs the assessor / surveyor to do the report for the buyer. Might cost a few dollars but would save heaps of hassels and would also educate "New Chums" (no offence) and stop them from being "Latest Chumps" (ditto)

Otherwise we are back were we started with issues like , Can we trust the vendor? is there stuff we are not being told about? etc etc.

I reckon its a bit like buying a house, employ your own agent to get you what you want, he works for you not the vendor.
Lots safer and less hassels and a better deal for me too.

Cheers
Chimo GOM esp in this cold weather!

[PADDLES]

G'day Chimo. I agree with you wholeheartedly. From what I can see, there's no regulation whatsoever on boating/marine equipment in this country (unless you are using the vessel commercially, in which case I think you need to get it surveyed). Even the power units (outboard or inboard) have no rules/standards applied to them in this country. Just like a roadie will give you maybe some peace of mind (and certainly someone to go back to if you end up with a lemon and the roadie is dodgy), some form of inspection for a boat at the time of purchase will unsure that you at least get something that is legal for towing on the road, in the case of a trailer boat, and has the correct safety gear for the size of vessel. By safety gear I mean a bilge pump, bucket, paddles etc. that are mandatory for any vessel. I don't mean lifejackets, epirb, nav gear etc. that can change with where you may be operating the vessel. The marine industry is basically self regulated, bordering on unregulated, and although there must be heaps of good operators out there I reckon the government needs to step in and give it a shake up. Look at anything else you may own, your house, your shed, your tv, your car, your bike, the list goes on, they're all inspected and tested to ensure that they are fit for use by the aussie public by some regulating authority. Your $50k boat (possibly the second most expensive thing you own next to your house) that your very life depends on every weekend isn't subject to any standards or scrutiny.

[Chimo]

Guys

Where the govt inspection concept falls down is the private sales.

I still reckon that buyers have to show some smarts and employ a surveyer etc if they are not sure. You will end up with a situation where you cannot sell second hand gear, boats etc if you insist on the govt being the inspector.

Won't work and really why the hell do you want more expensive Govt interference when a person employing their own inspector / surveyor will give a better and cheaper result for the affected indiividual.

I worked for Govt for nigh on forty yrs so I reckon I know what is within its capabilities and this isn't it...trust me!

Chimo

[peterbo3]

Your trailer (if over 750 kg gross) requires a Safety Certificate upon sale. Plus Qld Transport & police check ramps on occasion. My point is that a boat can be certified but may not be suitable for where it is going or the conditions on a given day.
If you take a 2WD car to Moreton Island & bog it in the sand, you will be laughed at. The car is bogged...........no more damage. Owner suffers massive loss of ego.
You take a safety-checked tinny across to Moreton & it turns nasty in the bay or you run out of fuel.............you may die. Others certainly have.
It is not about boats, only the people that operate them.