Hey Wusty,
Do you know anything about the new 2008 Suzuki engines?
I've just fitted 2 x DF140's to a 6.5KC and was going to hook em straight to my Lowrance 7200C with the EP-20's. Aparrently can't do it without buying a Suzuki SMIS gauge, to keep warning functions, and some major new connections and hassles. All to do with digital/analog/NMEA2000 changes on the new engine cables and connectors!!!
"Not Happy Jan"
Cheers, Scotty.
Hey Wusty
Thanks for all the helpfull info.
Are the SMIS displays and engine interface availlable in Australia?
Ian
Originally Posted by mirage
This info might help you and others considering the EP20 Interface
NMEA 2000 ENGINE INFORMATION
Suzuki, Yamaha, Evinrude Suzuki
Suzuki has engine models compatible with NMEA 2000 that can be configured
using our head units and gauges. An engine interface cable (EP-20) is required
2008 and later Suzuki engines, excluding the DF 300, will also require the Suzuki
K8 adapter.
The DF300 models will require a Suzuki DF300 adapter.
Suzuki interface cable (EP-20) and adapter cable part numbers:
120-06 Suzuki Eng Intrfce Cbl –BL 10ft
120-10 Suzuki Eng Intrfce Cbl –BL 10ft (OEM 6PK)
120-55 Suzuki Eng Intrfce Cbl – RD 10ft
120-56 Suzuki Eng Intrfce Cbl – RD 10ft (OEM 6PK)
120-67 FONT='Arial','sans-serif']Suzuki DF300 Single Engine Adapter (OEM)
120-68 Suzuki DF300 Dual Engine Adapter (OEM)
120-69 Suzuki DF300 Triple Engine Adapter (OEM)
120-80 Suzuki K8 Adapter
Suzuki engine models compatible with NMEA 2000 using the EP-20 interface
cable:
DF 40: 2008 and later models require Suzuki K8 Adapter 120-80
DF 50: 2008 and later models require Suzuki K8 Adapter 120-80
DF 60: 2008 and later models require Suzuki K8 Adapter 120-80
DF 70: 2008 and later models require Suzuki K8 Adapter 120-80
DF 90: 2008 and later models require Suzuki K8 Adapter 120-80
DF 115: 2008 and later models require Suzuki K8 Adapter 120-80
DF 140: 2008 and later models require Suzuki K8 Adapter 120-80
DF 150: 2008 and later models require Suzuki K8 Adapter 120-80
DF 175: 2008 and later models require Suzuki K8 Adapter 120-80
DF 200: 2008 and later models require Suzuki K8 Adapter 120-80
DF 225: 2008 and later models require Suzuki K8 Adapter 120-80
DF 250: 2008 and later models require Suzuki K8 Adapter 120-80
DF 300: Requires Suzuki DF300 adapter; single, dual, or triple depending
on the number of engines.
The Suzuki Engine interface can provide the following information over the
NMEA 2000 network:
• Engine RPM
• Alternator Voltage
• Engine Hours
• Fuel Flow
• Engine Trim
• Fuel Used
• Trip Fuel Used
• Seasonal Fuel Used
• Speed over water (DF300 Only)
• Water Pressure (DF300 Only)
• Current Gear (DF300 Only)
• Standard Diagnostics
Overheat
o Low Oil Pressure
o Over Rev
o Low Battery Voltage
Suzuki Engine Interface Configuration
The LMF-200 and LMF-400 can support up to three engines with one engine
interface for each engine. If you have one configured engine interface, it will be
displayed as Eng Int. If you have three configured fuel flows, they will appear as
Port Eng, Cen Eng and Stbd Eng. When the interface is unconfigured it will be
shown as UnCfg Eng. Each fuel flow has an internal menu with the following
options: Unset Engine, Change Engine. Fuel Warning, Reset and Reset Fuel
Calibration and Reset Trim Calibration.
NOTE:
If, after configuring, unconfiguring or reconfiguring an engine interface, it is not
shown on the Bus Devices list, you will have to refresh the list. To do this, let the
menu time out and press MENU. Select SYSTEM SETUP and press MENU.
Highlight B. DEVICES and press MENU. The Engine Interface will be listed with
its new configuration setting.
To configure Suzuki Engine Interface: LMF-200
1. Press MENU, use the UP and DOWN keys to select SYSTEM SETUP and
press MENU.
2. Highlight B. DEVICES and press MENU. The Bus Devices list will appear.
3. Select UNCFG ENG and press MENU. The following message will appear: Hit Menu to Cfg Eng Int. Press MENU.
4. The Suzuki Engine Model menu will appear with the following options:
DF40, DF50, DF60, DF70, DF90/115, DF140, DF150, DF175, DF200/225,DF250 and DF300.
Last edited by withoutatrace; 12-12-2007 at 09:33 AM.
G'day Ian,Hey Wusty
Thanks for all the helpfull info.
Are the SMIS displays and engine interface availlable in Australia?
Ian
Not sure if it's all available in Australia yet for the 2008 models. You need an adapter for the EP-20 (which I know is available in the US) to fit on these new donks with all the other connections and cables. I believe you can get the SMIS gauges and EP-20 here though.
My mechanic talked to Suzuki Australia, they didn't know much about the adaptor required for the EP-20. They sort of passed the buck to Lowrance, so I called Lowrance and they passed the buck back to Suzuki. Very frustrating.
This is the reply from a Suzuki dealer in the US for 2008 engines:
"The only factory recommended procedure is to eliminate your analog tachs (at least for the warning system - you can keep the tach functions) and install a Suzuki SMIS 4" gauge (similar to the Lowrance LMF-400). Along with the EP-20's and SMIS gauge you will have to purchase 2008 EP-20 adapters, NMEA 2000 network adapter and possibly other hardware to mate the Suzuki network to the Lowrance network. You will disconect the analog connectors at the engines and connect them to the ECM interface."
Cheers, Scotty.
Hi Ian,
The SMIS cable works off the computer port plug. Using a SMIS cable does NOT disconnect the analogue gauges. I still run both.
The 2008 motors are the same electrically for NMEA 2000. The issue is that previously the SMIS cables had BLUE connectors on the network end, but now that the standard is RED connectors, you need the RED/BLUE interface cable for the network end, not the motor end.
As to the whether the EP-20 cables need a Suzuki engine interface cable as well, I'd check that as the cable form and pinout hasn't changed in 2008 according to my dealer. I'm sure the issue is at the network end, not the motor end of the cable.
I bought my SMIS cable from a Suzuki dealer, not Lowrance, so I agree it is a Suzuki issue, not a Lowrance issue.
I also run a 4" SMIS Gauge because I didn't want a single point of failure of my alarms with my Lowrance. I agree with the approach of having a separate display gauge on the network for alarms.
Note that the NMEA2000 Buss power is usually provided by the cable harness with the Lowrance. If you want the 4" Gauge to operate without a Lowrance on the network, make sure you have an independent power cable to the Lowrance cable harness. And then disconnect the Lowrance NMEA2000 power cable as you only run one power supply to the network.
So Ian, I suspect that you are getting factually correct info, but it is not in the right context for your problem.
I suggest go back to the basics. Make sure you know what colour connector network you are using. Then buy only devices that connect with the same colour connectors, otherwise you need to RED/BLUE interface connectors and cables - like I had to do!
Don't be daunted though, it works fine. I run a mixed RED and BLUE network, and I have no problems. But it all needs to be laid out correctly as per my earlier posts with the linear form and network end resistors.
Wusty
Sorry Mirage, my last post was also to you.
For Ian, the SMIS cables and gauges are available in Oz from a Suzuki dealer.
The Lowrance screen pages display the engine data best. While the 4" gauges also do it, it scrolls thru on small pages, whereas on the Lowrance you can see as much as you want on the one page with no scrolling. Each has it's purpose though - I use both myself.
Wusty
Hey, thanks for the reply Wusty.
I follow most things you said. I'm still not sure though why the guy from the US (In the quote above) says I need to buy the SMIS gauge so all the engine warnings work and just use the tacho gauges as analog tachos. Currently the tachos are sort of multi function with all the warning lights incorporated.
From what I can tell he is saying that you just can't plug the Lowrance into the engine, even with the Blue/Red interface cables, EP-20 and the new Suzuki K8 Adapter (mentioned by without a trace above) without losing the engine warning system on the tachos. Therefore you need the SMIS gauge for the warning system! This was sort of implied by Suzuki in Australia as well.
Damn, I'm confusing myself again.
Cheers, Scotty.
Withoutatrace,
Thanks mate. Thats the first time I've seen or heard what the Suzuki adaptor for the EP-20 is called. Looks like it's the K8 Adaptor. Certainly Suzuki or Lowrance in Australia couldn't tell me!
Cheers, Scotty.
Hi Mirage,
I understand your frustration. I had real trouble working it out myself - and I learned that not many people I asked had actually built the network - specifically the Oz dealers at the moment because it is new to them too. I found the USA dealers to be disinterested in actually understanding what I wanted to do - in fact not one helped. I found most of my data in USA chat rooms. So, I'd be filtering any advice, including what I offer, against the background of a new technology and thin expertise.
The basic motor alarms don't need a 4" Gauge, or a NMEW2000 network. All the analogue signals are there and connected to the dash analogue displays. They will work regardless of the extra digital stuff.
At the next level of complexity, you can add a 4" display, or a few of them actually, to get digital data displayed.
Then at the next level, you can add a fishfinder and GPS, and network the lot to get fantastic fuel consumption and boat data. It's really impressive and was the main reason for me doing this myself.
But I didn't turn any of the three levels off. I still have a analogue tacho with the normal engine alarms. I have the 4" display which can work without all the other digital devices. And finally, I can turn the GPS module on, and fire up the Lowrance for all the integrated data displays.
I don't believe Suzuki has changed this three level architecture in 2008. The loss of the alarms to an analogue gauge seems a furphy because the computer port plug is simply picking up the same signals in parallel. It is not breaking the circuit to get the data. Nor is the computer port "loading" the circuit down so that the analogue signals don't work. I could be wrong on the 2008 motors, but I don't think so, as it doesn't make sense quite frankly.
I think what you are coming up against is that most people don't actually understand this stuff. What they know is if you do it "this way", it works, and if you buy "this", it works. Many don't actually understand how the networks link and the data is used. You could end up buying a few extra cables and displays, and not actually need them for what you want to do. I did, and they are sitting at home wasted.
My experience of all this is to lay out your required network on paper in real detail. Each cable and it's length needed, each connector and it's colour, and show how each device connects. Then get a minimal network working on the floor of the boat to prove the power supply and signals off the motor are working. Then only after you know it works, install it, and start adding devices one at a time, proving each before adding another.
Mate, just be methodical, lay it out, and don't buy anything despite who says what until you see for sure how it fits into your design. Then methodically bring the network up one device at a time.
Wusty
Thanks Wusty, all very good advice.
I agree with you, it just doesn't make sense that I need an SMIS gauge. As you say I can't see why it still wouldn't work keeping the tachos for rpm and warnings and using the Lowrance for fuel calculations, which is all I really want as extra info.
Good idea about doing it all on paper first.
Cheers, Scotty.
have just got smis running in parallel with the analog gauges on K8 250.andrew
Andrew, have you got data going into a gps as well?
Scotty.
Have done that and also contacted Raymarine US and Aust direct only to have the buck passed back and forth. I have also contacted lakeandsea.com without a reply. Any ideas or help would be great.
Ninja,
Try giving Trymax marine a call in capalaba, they do marine electronics, they may be able to help.
Regards
HOnda
Hey Ninja,
What is your exact problem again?
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