Been netting again

[tunaman]

Cause what I have stated is true. Yes I speak my mind and thats the plus about TM. Its not about having a opinion, Iam all for that, as you know. Just think about it, isnt fair, fair enough. Arnt the people been through enough. What else do the people want to take away for them.




signed tunaman

[crabman1958]

Its A Wonder They Got So Many.been To Sydney Fish Markets Lately.i Think We All Need To Look In Our Back Yards.

[kingtin]

Cause what I have stated is true. Yes I speak my mind and thats the plus about TM. Its not about having a opinion, Iam all for that, as you know. Just think about it, isnt fair, fair enough. Arnt the people been through enough. What else do the people want to take away for them.

signed tunaman

Sorry mate, but that's emotive claptrap. The sufferings of the indigenous population is not of my doing and me and mine will NOT carry the burden of guilt that your post seems to imply we should.

Yes, enough has been done to them, but it was/is not of my doing and the inference that they should be entitled to laws that give them benefits far above the majority is dangerous and counter-productive. The land which they claim as their's should not be used in order for the majority population to atone for sins perpetrated by those who went before. That is not only pandering to the greedy and manipulative but also denigrating to the good honest democratic folk who abide by the laws of Australia and who throughout their daily lives help other be they black, white or yellow.

We are all Australians...........it serves no good purpose for one group or individual to have a huge "chip on their shoulders" and to expect laws enacted for the protection of their culture, to benefit them at the expense of the majority. By all means enact laws for their protection, but not in such a way that those laws can be used to "put one over" on those who you feel owe it to you to make atonement for past mistreatment. If the laws are laws to protect tradition, then go about those laws in a traditional manner.

As fat Chilli has said, there are those who have "moved on" and are living happy and productive lives and this is the major problem here, there are too many of those who haven't moved on...........be they grogged up Aboriginals with a chip on their shoulder, or white do-gooders who think that everything will be solved by giving huge handouts (at the taxpayers expense) Handouts that are grossly mismanaged by the Indigenous people themselves. ............people who claim to be living the "traditional way" but can't manage to without a leg up from those innocents who they blame for their misfortune.

IT IS TIME TO MOVE ON....period.

Throughout my dealings with the child care system I have constantly heard it said and indeed, on paper, proven, that those who abuse their children do so, because they were abused. I have also heard it said (by kids) that they perpetrated abuse because "that's what mum and dad did". There are thousands of the abused out there who do not abuse quite simply because they "moved on". They handled their anger/despair at their own expense in order to protect others from what they may otherwise do if they didn't handle that anger. They did not allow a chip on their shoulder to take root in their psyche and dominate their's and their families lives. They do not expect handouts as compensation for what was perpetrated upon them by others, and they do not expect special treatment under the eyes of the law.

They "stand up and are counted" they rise above their grief, anger, and sorrow, and move on.............despite their genuine grievance, they rise above the easy recourse of blaming others and join in with that society whom others of their like blame for past sins. They become part of the society who's forefathers sinned in order to use their democratic vote to better that society. They use the benefits of that society/culture to further benefit them and their children. They work towards that goal and they become model citizens of a different culture and society to that which they once belonged. They do not use their past mistreatment as a crutch to get benefits that would not otherwise be afforded to them.

These are the ones who thrive and prosper, financially, physically and mentally. So it is with culture. Those who hold on to the "old ways" whilst still choosing to carry a huge chip on their shoulder, are likely to perpetrate further abuse on the offspring. I have heard social workers tell kids, and adults, "You have a right to be angry, I understand why you behave as you do" That kind of psychbabble is endemic and it is self-defeating. The abused use it as a crutch and excuse. Understanding is not condoning and "having a right" to be angry, is not the same as using that anger to get what you want.........unfortunately these are the mixed messages social workers send out to abusers just as the white pollies and the black elders send out mixed messages to the indigenous population.

The majority of that population "extracts" from other cultures only what they deem fit (ie motorised fishing boats) and invariably that is something that gives them short term satisfaction/gain but long term loss and dilution of culture. They feel they have a right to be angry and behave anti-socially and they misinterpret that right as a green light to go ahead with their attitude/behaviours. Just as the perpetrator of child abuse, they are quite simply hypocrites and cowards who live for the now and blame any of their transgressions on the cruel circumstances inflicted on their forefathers. They have come to a fork in the road of their lives and have simply taken the shorter, easy, less stony path, to misery and vindictiveness, rather than travel a longer harder path to peace, reconciliation, and integration. they have "CHOSEN" to dwell on their misery, to abuse their kids and drown themselves in grog, rather than take the harder path of forgiveness and acceptance. So PLEASE Mr TM............do not lay their misery at my doorstep, I've had enough of my own in my lifetime, thank you.

I am not racist, I am far from it, as anyone who knows my history in the Labour Party and Transport and General Worker's union will know. I have grown up since then though and now simply tell it as it is (for me) As opposed to fighting for how I think it should be.

Yes, the indigenous population has been cruelly mistreated. yes, they have a bloody hard time of it and it doesn't seem to be getting any better. yes, I sympathise/empathise. yes, indigenous affairs are a complete balls up. NO! I do not accept responsibility and will not support legislation that allows them traditional rights via untraditional methods.

What has this to do with fishing??????? Quite simply this, if we continue to support laws that are enacted by those politically correct knobheads who can't see that all they're doing is creating division amongst race, and pandering to those who think the world owes them a living, then the dugong are doomed as are the barra in certain sytems. The easier they find it to catch, and the quicker they turn a buck, then the more they'll do it, spurred on by the unscrupulous whitie who professes to be their mate.

Ask yourself this. Are we (Australian society) guilty of decline in dugong and fish population" Yes! But have our laws the intent of slowing that decline? I think so, although intent may not be enough. Do those laws protect dugong decline from Aboriginal impact? I think not. The easier it gets (adoption of white method) the more the dugong population will decline. Is that fair? isn't that what this thread is about? Go on, ask yourself, IS THAT FAIR?

I rest my case.

kev

[ShaneC]

Posted by accident before finishing, read below

[ShaneC]

Kingtin,
Beautifully said as usual mate, run for PM and you have my vote.

Tunaman, for a change, how about making an informed post, instead of simply going against the general concensus of the website in order to generate controversy. I would be very interested to see a post where you could generate an educated opinion regarding the issues you raise and back it up with actual facts. Ok, white settlers came to Australia, set up camp and prospered. What would have happened if the Spanish or the Dutch had done it?? We wouldn't be having this argument!!!

An indiginous population does not have a God given right to do as they please. I have and continue to work in countries that have a native population that have gone rogue. I am not saying for a second that it applies to native Australians, but there is an element of law that was introduced over 200 years ago, so the folk who were directly affected are long gone. Those that are here to enjoy the fruitful nature of life in Australia should be proud of what we have and be happy to represent it. Just because you are a descendent of an indiginous person doesnt give you the right to flaunt the law. Those that do should consider themselves lucky they are not in some countries where the punishment for crime is a lot harsher.

We are lucky to have laws.... I don't agree with some of them trust me, but at the end of the day thats what makes our home such a wonderful place to be. Black, white, yellow, purple or green, everyone should be bound by these laws, including the laws that pertain to the taking of a natural resource from a public waterway.

I am just on a roll because I spent 20 mins of in depth thought to reply to a post that got taken off before I could submit.

I am not stirring, nor am I racist, I have a black dog and a colour tv (THATS A JOKE!!!!)

Shane

[kingtin]

Kingtin,

<snip>

I am just on a roll because I spent 20 mins of in depth thought to reply to a post that got taken off before I could submit.


Shane

Mate, you've no idea what my thoughts on that thread stirred in me either but it is for the best, it really doesn't belong on a fishing forum unless stimulated by the topic of fishing and that particular thread wasn't. All hail to the mods and I shall attempt to keep my feelings to myself in future............please note I did say "attempt"

kev

[ShaneC]

Kev

My other post was funnier, smarter and more informative.... bugger. I think I could have started a revolution. Thank God for the mods!!!!!!

One month to go, I will see you on the Pine mate.

Shane

[kingtin]

Kev

My other post was funnier, smarter and more informative.... bugger. I think I could have started a revolution. Thank God for the mods!!!!!!

One month to go, I will see you on the Pine mate.

Shane

Look forward to it mate.............I'll be flying a red flag and singing The Internationale............we'll renew the revolution together

"Stand up, all victims of oppression,
For the tyrants fear your might!
Don't cling so hard to your possessions,
For you have nothing if you have no rights!
Let racist ignorance be ended,
For respect makes the empires fall!
Freedom is merely privilege extended,
Unless enjoyed by one and all."

Revised lyrics courtesy of Billy Bragg



kev

[ShaneC]

Kev,

Your work is gold brother!! I hear you are the man to fish with if you are after catties for crab bait????

I bet we could share a few stories between sting rays. It would be a funny day out, trust me you bloody Poms are still no good at cricket!!!!

Check your PM's mate

[kingtin]

Kev,

you bloody Poms are still no good at cricket!!!!

This bloody Pom's no good at anything other than catching crab bait

kev

[PinHead]

Kev,

Your work is gold brother!! I hear you are the man to fish with if you are after catties for crab bait????

I bet we could share a few stories between sting rays. It would be a funny day out, trust me you bloody Poms are still no good at cricket!!!!

Check your PM's mate

mate, Kev's lovely other half would shoot you for referring to catties as crab bait..they are dinner.

[tunaman]

Mr kingtin and company. Nice speech, I stand corrected. Go in pease my son , and lets all put blinkers on and run with the rest of the horses\ sheep.

Having a opinion is the right of all people, some agree and some dont. But it sure does make the world go around. Your advice is taken and understood.

Sorry to all member for opening my mouth once again. Facts you say, OK I think I can do that. Thanks for putting me strait.


signed tunaman

[kingtin]

Mr kingtin and company. Nice speech, I stand corrected. Go in pease my son , and lets all put blinkers on and run with the rest of the horses\ sheep.

signed tunaman

Mr T, my thoughts are my own and are not derived from any "company". I am far from blinkered and do not run with any sheep or horses. Sometimes I wish I did and then perhaps I wouldn't embroil myself in futile discussion. I despair of those who DO run with the sheep, either because it nurses their ego to think the run is a charitable one and they are charitable, or simply because they are brain washed, either by the politically correct, the media, or their own prejudices.

Sheep conjure up images of docile inoffensive grazers, when in fact, en masse, they can create havoc due simply to their docility and failure to see further than the other sheep. They act en masse and that is something I do not do. I am a free thinker.

My "speech" as you call it is nothing more than my thoughts based on MY experiences and seen through MY eyes, not through the rose coloured glasses of those who think that traditional rights and reconciliation will result in a better life for the indigenous population. Traditional rights must be tempered with fairness and equality, and reconciliation should not be based on the subjugation of majority rights or the free for all land grabs that those in some clans would like to see. Nor should reconciliation only be afforded to those who apologise for the sins of those who went before. I am not to be blamed for the acts of generations gone and I am not to lie down quietly simply because one group wishes to claim this land as their own.

I am not white, I am not yellow, I am not aboriginal, I am not racist, I certainly am not a sheep. What I am is part of the fellowship of man. The fellowship that believes good will only prevail through just and fair laws applicable to all. Have one law for one and exemption for another, and we are doomed.

I am Australian............not Kiwi Baaaaaaaaa

kev

[Raesen]

I am not game to go here too much info/agro/love.
Whats happening with the:-
Whiting
Black Bream
Yellow fin tuna
Red emporer
Rainbow trout
Blue marlin
Spangled perch - spangled what colur is spangled ???? Perthaps all of US !!!!

We are all the same. We are Aussies and its US not our ancestors.

Happy fishing within the law to all.
Have a good one
Pete
My thoughts and my opinion

[kingtin]

I am not game to go here too much info/agro/love.
Whats happening with the:-
Whiting
Black Bream
Yellow fin tuna
Red emporer
Rainbow trout
Blue marlin
Spangled perch - spangled what colur is spangled ???? Perthaps all of US !!!!

We are all the same. We are Aussies and its US not our ancestors.

Happy fishing within the law to all.
Have a good one
Pete
My thoughts and my opinion

Pete, simple yet thoughtful. Colour has no bearing. Good on yer mate.

kev