scuppers on a riptide - are they too low ?

[revs57]

G'day Dooley,

The seals are the issue, some bloke leave the seals in the scupper when they paint and the seal stuff up accordingly. Remove the seal when painting and shouldn't be a problem. The only time water comes in to my Riptide though the scupper is when I've emptied the deck after a deck wash or kill tank over flow and forgotten to close the scupper and a wave might slosh up...but it does drain away so its not a real problem...cools the feet

Glad I've got them...certainly not a marketing tool in my opinion Scott, I use them every trip when cleaning the deck to ship the water away and the added safety benefit if I ever cop one, it can clear very quickly. The sealed air tanks for positive bouyancy means the deck height will always be above sea level so any water on the deck will drain off...an added bonus in my opinion

Cheers

Rhys

[FNQCairns]

Hi Stewart, sorry I don't think I fully understand what you are saying. But about the stabi they are not mucking around with gimmics, the scuppers on these will never sink them, it will actually float higher after a true swamping and given some time with the scuppers than without! and do it unassisted.
The scuppers on the Stabi are an adjunct to a boat that doesn't really need them but is yet again a better boat because of them. This cannot be said for the boats we have been talking about previous.

Cheersfnq

[FNQCairns]

Dam I hate this buggy new ausfish software! press return and the reply disappears!.

So again, Hi Rhy's, they certainly are nice for washdown, your sealed tanks add nothing to buoyancy unless they are surrounded by water the hull is what creates uplift through displacement for instance a foam filled hull has no more buoyancy (actually less) than one without foam unless sunk!.

Here lies the problem because all of the buoyancy is below deck the boat will turn turtle way way before the scuppers can even start clearing the above deck water. The scuppers will not save the boat unless it could have been saved anyway, but they have sunk many a small boat.

cheers fnq

[seatime]

Spot on FNQ, a sealed floor in any vessel, or the sealed floor and sealed pontoons in a Stabi-craft are reserve buoyancy.
While a boat may weigh 1 tonne out of the water, it might only weigh 100kg in the water (for argument's sake), this is it's displacement. Archimedes law.
If you were to place a 100kg block of alloy in water it would sink, and only displace about 1kg.
The difference between the boat and the block, is their shape.

The advantage that boats with 'upright flotation' have is they won't turn turtle. Scuppers have nothing to do with upright flotation, they are there to get rid of incidental water, and the boat usually needs to be making way to free that water.
The Riptides are a great boat from all reports, I considered them when looking for a boat. However to get the CoPF and uprightedness, the gunnels would have needed to be filled with foam and I would have lost a lot of storage area.
regards

[Stuart]

FNQCairns

Not looking an argument here mate, But I have to ask, how do scuppers sink a boat? If scuppers are a one way flow only, like mine are then I can not see how they can sink a boat.

Stu

[saurian]

Stu , I think what Fnq is getting at, is boats capsizing after filling with seawater from an undetermined source.
(maybe scuppers closed???) Scuppers or not you are doomed in small boat as such to tip over.( turn turtle)
Which is beyond me, what that has to do with scupper heights as to origin of thread. I don't think he has owned a vessel with scuppers to understand the rain issue........
But not worth going there.
Ta

[FNQCairns]

Stewart, ANY situation that sees the scuppers underwater (externally) without propulasion.

Saurion 2.5 with scuppers (all glass boats), the .5 because the scupprs got taped up after first offshore trip and the boat re-sold not long after.

cheers fnq

[Stuart]

I understand mate.
Stu

[sempre]

The scuppers on the Riptides are a manual release , at least mine are , if you open them at anchor they dont let much water in , depending on the conditions of course , btw they dont leak , not after 2 years anyway .
Sam...

[reef_king]

it sounds like theres is alot of poor designed boats and scupper systems. A "properly designed scupper" is supposed to be a postive asset to a boat NOT a negative, and should allow water to drain effectivly while under way and at rest.

FNQ,
On my own boat i have nothing but prasie for the scupper system. I have a 7m coastal cat with a fully sealed floor, and three scupers. The only bilge pumps i have on the boat are 2x1500GPH mounted on the transom that pump water into the boat(bait tanks). Without scuppers id be screwed. Less than a month ago i took a 3.5m breaking wave over the front in a bar.......at very least a tonne of water......it was gone in seconds. Sunday morning just passed was out in 30knts and took a 3m FREAK wave that popped up from nowhere and broke on the bow at the anchor........again gone in seconds. Clearly scuppers work in boats below 30ft and without them i would've been screwed. You keep going on about boats filling up to there gunnells, becuase of the scuppers on my boat it would be very hard to get water to the gunnels, unless it was a huge breaking wave and in that case the wave would most likley flip the boat.

[sempre]

O.K lets not call it a "properly designed scupper " , instead how about manual water release system , does that help anyone .
I"m not having a go at anyone but i'm sure you'll find on the Riptides that in the event of a huge displacement of water on the deck , water pressure will in fact open these flaps.If you want them closed , just close them.

[FNQCairns]

Yeah Reef king, I don't know the coastal cats and would take your word about how the system works as most cats are 'larger' than monos length for length. For instance what is the waterline length/waterline width ratio of your boat, also what height above the static waterline is your deck.

I suspect there will be other vessels like tri hulls, tunnel hulls, even hydrofoils, hope that's enough covenant's, but good to hear your experience with that particular design of boat.



cheers fnq

[revs57]

But to answer the question...are the scupper too low on a Riptide, Both Sempre (with a 7.4 mt Riptide) and myself (a 6mt Riptide) have no problem with our boats and are glad for the set up

Cheers

Rhys

[Dr DRIFT]

Ive got a haines signature 575f and the scupper do not let water in... only out... when I wash the deck to get rid of blood after a catch, all the water just goes out and never has the water come in.... Its only a 5.75m boat.....

[Mr__Bean]

Back in September 2004 there was a $50,000 Shimano fishing comp on Port Phillip Bay. The comp ran from lunchtime to lunchtime and even though the conditions were quite rough on the bay (20-30 knots) many boats head out for the night.

One of the boats was a 7 metre plate ally boat that reportedly had a history of leaky scuppers and also (reportedly) had a history of having about 2 inches of water in it at times around your feet. No big deal just motor off and bleed it off out the back, actually gives the floor a good rinse.

Trouble was this night was quite rough and through out the night it started to fill more than usual. When it got to about 6 inches deep they decided it was time to motor off and empty the boat as usual. After hitting the electric winch button the nose of the boat went down as it tried to clear the stuck fast anchor and the deck water rushed forward into the cabin. There was no recovery once this started and the 7 metre boat rolled forward and capsized.

Two guys spent 10 hours in treading water in Port Phillip bay in 20-30 knot winds at 16 degrees, but luckily were picked up by others that had also braved the weather for the comp (bloody mad).

So yes I agree scuppers can be a problem if not set up right in a medium size boat, but I think it depends how the complete boat is set up not just the scuppers. From what I understand, the boat in the incident above did not have a "step up" barrier between the main deck floor and the front cabin. This is critical to prevent any water washing forward and down into the front cabin as once it is in their you cannot power it out.

For interest I have the manual scuppers that are about 100mm above the at rest water line and yes, I have had them leak a bit if the boat has its back to the sea in a reasonable chop, but as others have stated it is about maintaining the seals.

They are 6 inch by 4 inch and are opened before crossing a bar and then closed off once clear of any rough water. I have also opened them if out in a heavy sea just in case a big one is taken or if I stuff up somehow.

By choice I would have them but maintain them.

- Darren