Spider Hitch

[steve_n]

I have trouble tying a bimini twist for a double in braid. ??? Is the spider hitch a suitable substitute or should I keep trying to get the bimini right?
Steve

[Roo]

Steve,
I've only just learn't the bimini myself and i've gotta say I can get a much neater and better looking knot in braid than mono. I'd fooling around with some old mono for a few goes but they always turned out a bit twisted but the first go at braid was neat as and is fishing very nicely.

I had a go at the spider hitch but i was worried it would cut itself.

Keep going with the twist for sure.

Cheers, Roo.

[Goodoochaser]

Keep practicing Steve its worth getting it right, the bimini twist is what it implies, it is a twist not a knot. The bimini will retain 100% of the lines breaking strain, where as knots won't.
Depending on how you attach your leader to the bimini, it also flows through the rod guides a lot smoother, this is important if you do a lot of casting. Knots in braid can blow up and break when repeatedly hitting guides at high speed.
I make my leaders by spining approx 5 to 6 meters of fluro leader in a drill, then by taking the mid point and bringing the 2 ends together it spins up double. (it takes a bit of practice to get the right amount of twists and to do it without tangles) You then join the leader to the bimini with a double loop to loop with twist connection.
I use this on my bait casting rigs, I find it very strong, runs through the guides very smoothly and the twisted leader has a built in spring almost like a shock absorber.

Howard

[Goodoochaser]

Steve
I will try to post a drawing of how to make the leader that I was describing, I'm no artist but it may be of interest if it turns out. It can be tricky to do but once mastered is worth while. I have been useing this method for quite a few years and it has not failed me yet. I make up several at a time and coil them up and place in small plastic coin bags untill required.
For most of the fishing I do, I twist 12lb vanish to give me a 24lb leader and twist 20lb vanish for a 40lb leader if after large Barra.

Cheers Howard

Howard

[steve_n]

Wow :o Thanks Howard that looks like really great leader setup.
Looks like I'll have to keep practicing to get the bimini twist right.
Thanks again for your suggestions.
Steve.

[Cheech]

Steve,

With the bimini, I found that Geoff Willson's book made the bimini way harder than it needs to be to learn. Particularly the locking of the knot. It may be a really cool way to do it if you have the time and in the comfort of your home, but try doing it off shore with a bit of roll and in the dark..... Forget the over turns with a slide back through the middle. Just a couple of simple half hitches (is that what they are called) will do with braid to hold it.

Try the non foot version. When I learnt it I found it trick to try to co-ordinate the foot, try to get the right length to be able to actually use my foot....

What I do now is just have the rod in the rod holder and then do the bimini around my hand. 30 (some use 40) twists with about 30mm of tag. The actual loop near my hand is only very small. This is the key. Then you pull on the tak and open your hand as required to tighten the spiral of the twists. Then when it is tight (maybe 20 30mm), you eaze the tension on the tag just a little and you will find that the tag then wants to start spiralling back on the twist. You need to practice a bit to feed the tag correctly over the top of the existing spiral. The benefit of doing it with your hand is that you can untwist it by reducing the tension in your hand and increasing the tension on the tag, and re-try your tag spiral again.

Then when the tag spiral gets to the correct place to need locking off, just do one route through the centre of the loop with the tag which then stops it unravelling whilst you do your couple of half hitches to lock it.

With this method I can whip one up in a minute or 2.

I then use a braid/leader knot to connect my leader. If you use this knot, just make sure you keep tension on the tag when tightening it off otherwise it can slip through before locking.

Howard,

Great diagrams on the twisted leader. I have heard about people making them with drills, but never fully understood the process till now.

What is a loop to loop with twist?

What I also do not understand with twisted leaders,, because I have never actually seen one in use, is how you do your basic connections to the terminal tackle. I use uni knots to my hooks, but I do not think that would work if it is douple line. I am sure I am missing an important part of the process.

Cheech

[steve_n]

Thanks for the tip cheech. I havent had a problem actually forming the twist its ust the finishing lock that has been slipping. I'll try the half hitches as you suggest then hopefully the whole thing wont slide open as has been happening. I dont seem to have this problem with mono. Thats why i have been using the spider hitch with the braid. I really appreciate the helpful advice given by fellow Ausfishers.
Steve.
PS is the spider hitch really not worth using?

[Goodoochaser]

Cheech,
I new someone would ask about the loop to loop connection, couldn' t work out how to draw it, but I will try to explain.
First coil up the twisted leader into a small coil that will pass through the double you have made in the braid, use a bit of tape to hold it together.
Pass the braid loop end through the leader loop, open the braid loop and pass the whole coiled leader through the loop in the braid, if you closed it now it would look bit like a fig 8 or Reef knot and would work, but a stronger join is obtained if you draw out the braid pass it through the leader loop again then twist it 360 deg and put the whole leader back through again.
Clear as mud uhh. I will look for a picture and try to post it.
It is shown in Geoff Wilsons Knot book under Loop & Cross-Loop Connections.
The best knot to tie your terminal gear to the twisted leader is the Uni knot, I used to tie a locked blood knot but find the Uni knot pulls up better.
I make up 10 or so leaders at a time and attach a Norman Speed clip to each with the Uni Knot.

Cheers Howard

[Goodoochaser]

oops! :-/ sorry about big picture, can be used to tie up cruise ships ::)

Howard

[agnes_jack]

Steve
The spider hitch does have a tendancy to slip in braid, although I still use it for lighter lines such as 2-3kg in mono or braid without any problems. Heavier lines, I aiways use the Bimini.

Regards, Tony

[Cheech]

Thanks Howard. Makes more sense with the diagram. Not meaning to be picky, but that is a 180 twist.

I thought that is what you may have meant with a loop to loop connection.

I will give it a go because I have an overhead with a level wind and even a bimini with a braid/leader knot and I still have troubles getting through the slot in the level wind. The loop to loop will solve the problem as I also use uni knots on everything else so if you can tie a uni on the twist I have it all covered.

Thanks for taking the time out to draw and post.

Cheech

[A_DIFF_PERSPECTIVE]

bimini twist finished knot strength compared to the spider hitch finished knot strength (in most braids) is like the difference between winning 100,000 dollars in lotto(bimini), and finding 20 cents on the footpath(spider hitch)! the platt is equally as good as the bimini in braid. spider hitch is much better accepted when tied in mono. practice makes perfect!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
cheers,
Johnny M

[spapstick]

good stuff

[Heath]

The bimini twist is a lot easier in braid than mono. With a bit of practice you can tie then in under a minute flat.

At what point do you have the trouble?