RED GREEN How hard is it?

[preso]

Went down the Pin today, saw 4 boats and a jet ski high and dry on mud flats. I know its a tricky bit of water but some of these boats were worth more than my house. Anyway my grandson caught his first fish at 20 mths. AWESOME;D

[MTAQ/BTAQ]

It starts with one going the wrong side then the rest following do the same thing, it becomes a serial event - I see it many times at Scarborough when one comes in on the left then the others follow - fortunately they do not run aground.

[gazza2006au]

its very easy "red right out" and "green to green going up stream" some spots in sydney can become bloody confusing on australia day i was within the markers on the south coast and hit the sand bar drifted slightly away from the sand bar and anchored to watch everyone else do the same thing within 20mins we watched 7 boats and 1 jetski hit the same sand bank lol

[Andy56]

I took my eye off the horizon at hastings while trying to reset the sounder and bingo, not hard at all! The fact that lots of people make this mistake suggests that it isn't fool proof so there is room for improvement. Where is Steve Jobs when you need some one to get things done properly, lol
This does beg the question though, are there enough markers on our little channels?

[Fed]

I'm going to make a sticker for the top of my windscreen.


JETSKIERS KEEP RIGHT---->

[gpz1991]

I took my eye off the horizon at hastings while trying to reset the sounder and bingo, not hard at all! The fact that lots of people make this mistake suggests that it isn't fool proof so there is room for improvement. Where is Steve Jobs when you need some one to get things done properly, lol
This does beg the question though, are there enough markers on our little channels?


I agree with Andy, I have been boating for over 10 years a lot of our channels could use a few more markers or markers that are easier to see, never actually run a ground but had a few close calls, a section of the Hastings channel in particular has a marker that is very easy to miss as it is easier to see the next marker and before you know it you are in .9 meter of water. If you are lucky and not stuck in the mud (depends on stage of tide) 1 extra marker would make all the difference for those with out chart plotter

[Richo1]

How hard is it, head on situation with another boat - alter course to starboard and pass red to red!

So so many boaties don't know this. In a boat the rules are different to driving your car!

[WalrusLike]

How hard is it, head on situation with another boat - alter course to starboard and pass red to red!

So so many boaties don't know this. In a boat the rules are different to driving your car!

Yeah I've gotten tired already of altering course to starboard and have the oncomming boat turn to port. It could get dangerous.

With regard to plotters and beacons.... I am finding that the plotter is saying keep to port but the beacon says go to starboard. The banks or beacons have moved presumably. (it's not a case of misunderstanding the direction of bouyage)

So I can understand someone might blindly follow the chart and come to grief. But many are just unaware of the direction of bouyage.

[Tickleish]

An old sea dog once told me, There are skippers who have hit ground and there's ones who haven't yet!

[netmaker]

easy jingle to remember: green to green, red to red, all is well - go ahead. if in danger or in doubt, run in circles, scream and shout.

[Gazza]

Even the Big Boys :-X

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/sunday-mail/fishing-vessel-runs-into-trouble-on-sandbar-off-point-cartwright-on-sunshine-coast/story-e6frep2f-1226321023662

[frosti]

its all to easy until you are colour blind

[Muddy Toes]

What........and shape blind?

[WalrusLike]

Yeah those beacon shapes are correct no matter what angle you look from. I know it's a simple idea but I am always impressed by it as I pass one.

Imagine how good it must have felt to have had that idea for the person who first thought of it.

[dnej]

these comments are all very well, except for the difference of coming into or out of port. Same markers, different side of the boat, in each case.

[ozscott]

Having cut my boating teeth at the Pin many years ago without a GPS and without a sounder the beacons can be very confusing with sudden changes in nav bouy direction. One second you are navigating into port the next the direction is reversed even though your direction had only changed marginally. The pin has a lot of traps even when on the correct side of the markers. I'm not embarrassed to say that early on I found myself in tight water and pushing the boat off. I reckon the only person who, especially without a sounder and gps, has not got the skeg of a speed boat on the mud at the pin is the person who hasn't spent much time there. Cheers

[Gon Fishun]

Thats why it is a horses arse in the Bribie Passage on public holidays etc. Bouyage Nth to Sth ;) and I reckon a bit of local knowledge goes a very long way.::)

[Fed]

Red to red & green to green is how the Jetskiers drive down here, at least they're right half the time but I always strike them when I'm coming in.

[trueblue]

I hit the bottom 3 times in the last 2 days, and all properly within the defined markers

lots of shallow water around with close to the lowest astronomical tides at present. once at caboolture river and twice at viccy point yesterday

[Lancair]

Ive been abused for altering course to starboard, so as to attempt passing port to port. The guy let fly at me after he kept going to attempt to pass me on my starboard side and ran onto a sand bar, idiot.

Bewarw they walk amoung us and breed !

[Stuart]

It all went down hill when the government made it illegal to kill people. I don’t bother going fishing on public holidays, to many weekend worriers that wouldn’t have to brain cells amongst the lot of them. At times there seems to be only one person in 1000 that knows what side to pass or indeed any other regulation for that matter. These days I give most a wide berth to allow for there potential stupidity. The government can come up with more rules and guidelines but they can never legislate for common sense, let’s face it, common sense isn’t common anymore. I cut my teeth on commercial boats from the age of 16 plotting courses up North using a map, compass and rule. Knowing how to read a chart was essential. Seems the onset of GPS and chart plotters “navigational aids only” have taken away the need to remember the rules of the water when they get there license. I don’t believe there should be a simple course or multiple-choice questionnaire to getting a boat license. It should be more hands on and certainly more involved.

[Lucky Loz]

Can be very confusing with oxbow bends and split channels working out which way is out or in when tide is not running or your a champagne and chicken boatie who doesnt know if tide is running which way. My suggestion would be to paint green triangles bright lime green (for happy,going fishing) on the way out of river and dark green( not happy, end of fishing) on reverse side when coming upsstream. split lenses could also do this on lights. Once you know direction your travelling, red is also apparent. What say you?? Loz

[charleville]

It all went down hill when the government made it illegal to kill people.



When did they do that??? Bugger!

That's the bloody LNP government for you. First they kill off the Literary awards and then they do that. The bloody mongrels!



;D

[Marlin_Mike]

refer to your charts, they show the bouyage direction with arrows and red and green dots either side of the arrow head. I am sorry, but IMHO it isn't that hard if you look at a chart.



Mike

[Muddy Toes]

refer to your charts, they show the bouyage direction with arrows and red and green dots either side of the arrow head. I am sorry, but IMHO it isn't that hard if you look at a chart.



Mike

And therein lies the problem Mike.........how many boaties carry paper charts, have the ability to read them and don't use their GPS as their only source of navigation aid?

[Bull]

Is it still law that you have to carry paper charts and not rely on gps as your only means of navigation?

[TheRealAndy]

Is it still law that you have to carry paper charts and not rely on gps as your only means of navigation?

NO law as far as i know.

Still, if you are heading out into waters unknown to you, and you dont have a paper chart (beacon to beacon is good in qld) then you are mad IMO. A quick look at a chart and all should become obvious. Yup, I have scrubbed bottom in unfamiliar areas, but its always up uncharted creeks chasing muddies. Guess what I dont do?? I dont go fast, i take it easy and slow, till I have figured it out.

[Fed]

Having charts is still compulsory in NSW for offshore work, I can't imagine them ever changing that. Same for a magnetic compass.

[midcoast learner]

Having charts is still compulsory in NSW for offshore work, I can't imagine them ever changing that. Same for a magnetic compass.
It should be compulsory to carry charts even on enclosed waters ie. rivers , lakes and such.I have been a member of our local VMR since September last.The last 2 Saturdays we have had a capsize and a breakdown.No charts on board so they didn't know where they were so it took longer to find them.At least with a chart they may have a rough idea where they are.

[Corry]

Had the same a few weeks back in Prossy River, boat coming other way, I moved over to the Stb side, he kept moving over to his Port side, in the end I had to sharply move back over, he looked at me and with his mate in the boat started to wave his hands, I shook my head and then they come to a stop looking like they were going to turn around and come after us, would have been welcomed, lot of crocs up here so there's always more than just a rod in the boat, just in case of rouge animals of course lol.

Cheers
Corry

[Fed]

When I first got a boat license I didn't understand the rules, I had thing thing in my head saying, "red to red, red is left, green is right, blah blah blah".
I just didn't get it.
Fortunately the little old testing guy down under the harbour bridge with his boat board and little coloured boats set me straight, it hit me like a ton of bricks.... Ahhh so that's how it works! Everything is reversed when you're going in the opposite direction! Who would have thought that!

I think that's exactly what's happening now, they're not playing chicken, they just don't understand.
I'm going to wave the next guy down and tell him he's driving on the wrong side.

[Marlin_Mike]

And therein lies the problem Mike.........how many boaties carry paper charts, have the ability to read them and don't use their GPS as their only source of navigation aid?

The responsibility lies with the vessel master. If you dont know an area, then get to know it, buy the chart, buy a beacon to beacon, but taake the time to find out, dont jump in blindly, the duty still lies with the skipper.

Mike

[Fed]

What is this beacon to beacon thing, has anyone got a pic or something?

[charleville]

What is this beacon to beacon thing, has anyone got a pic or something?



It is a book of maps....
http://www.marinasguide.com.au/planner/guidebeacontobeacon.htm


I am not sure that they can be properly termed "charts" in the formal sense of what that word means in maritime circles, but the maps are very good. Anyone in SE Queensland with a boat should have one. The maps are especially good for doing what the name says - guiding you from beacon to beacon - or across the bay - or anywhere on the water. They show the recommended path to take through the beacons.


They are widely available.


.

[IcyDuck]

It's just like a street directory but for waterways. I've always got it onboard and have a good look at it before I go anywhere I'm not familiar with. I'm not sure if it is available in states other than Qld but here is the link

http://www.msq.qld.gov.au/Publications.aspx

Regards,
Phil

[ozscott]

Problem with the pin is shifting banks. Charts don't account for that oddly enough so local knowledge is the go - which is code for get out as often as you can and sus it out whilst not going flat knacker. Cheers

[Stuart]

I approach my boating with the assumption that no one in sight of me knows what the hell they are doing. In most cases, I’m proven right. I remember fondly when I was fishing wide of the Barwon banks, a guy pulled up a few meters next to me and yelled out “What way is home mate, my GPS is broken”. WTF, are you joking?. The sun is setting mate, what way do you think it is? He had no clue, if I told him East he would have run out of fuel with out seeing land. This guy was a local so go figure.

[Stuart]

Ask anyone if they know how to read a chart and I bet they say “what a chartplotter”. Most of my mates don’t know how to work out Lat and Long from a chart.

[Marlin_Mike]

Ask anyone if they know how to read a chart and I bet they say “what a chartplotter”. Most of my mates don’t know how to work out Lat and Long from a chart.

My point exactly Stuart..............they should make the effort to learn

Mike

[WalrusLike]

I've been thinking of making a idiot proof sign for the ning nongs that keep charging at me on the wrong side of the channel.

In big letters I could hold it up as they go past:

ON THE WATER
KEEP TO THE RIGHT!

[Homer_Jay]

Well bugga me, I have run aground at the pin, with the change of direction in and out of port. Maybe I should have rolled the paper chart out on the middle thwart of the tinne. I guess I am not perfect.

I have also been guilty of passing on the wrong side once or twice. After driving the car for thousands of miles and not being on the water for a while, a momentary lapse of concentration. But that was quickly fixed by the bloke with his waving some sort of signals at me ( some sort of sign language I didn't quite understand), nice fella he was, pointing out the fact I am not perfect!

I also ride a jet ski some days...... Is there any help for me?????
:-?:-?:-?

[WalrusLike]

Homer I do understand that mistakes happen. I know because I keep making them... 😄

It's quite right of you to point out that we all go wrong sometimes. Thanks for being sensible and pointing that out. I personally don't make rude gestures to others because it's counterproductive. I really wasn't serious about making a sign.

Although the odd boat turning the wrong way is explainable, there seems to be too many to be explained by occasional error.

I think many just don't know that oncomming boats should veer to starboard. (the right hand side. 😁)

Also, many seem unaware that smallish sail boats may have deep keels and can't be shoved further to the channel edge.

In wide open areas it's safe to pick the side of the route that suits you, but in channels we need to stick to the right to avoid customising by crunch. I wish more knew this basic marine principle.

Regarding bouyage direction, I think it's a shame there isn't a diagonal black bar down through the upstream side of the markers to indicate the reverse of the marker. Having said that, everyone should either already know, or check the chart.

Sorry for the long post... My two cents worth.

[Grand_Marlin]

Everyone has to learn, but this is stuff that you must know to keep yourself and others safe.
In saying that, I have driven up the wrong side of the highway in Texas... :-[

Cheers

Pete

[Richo1]

One thing to remember is that you only need to follow Rule 14 "Head on situation" (eg. Alter course to starboard) if a risk of collision exists. No risk of collision, no need to alter to starboard. However, when in narrow channels or fairways it is recommended to stay on the right side of the centre of the channel. No problems being in the center, just alter to starboard when another boat approaches from the opposite direction.
Crossing situation "red has right of way" if your showing the other boat your red side the other boat gives way to you and vice versa - if a risk of collision exists.
Cheers Richo

[frosti]

i am talking at night

[fat-buoy]

I was taught the old addage long ago.

There is red wine left in the bottle... essentially red - left - in .... so when you are heading in to port (wine) you keep the red to your left.. makes navi so much easier but I always have that stupid fckn saying banging around in my head haha

Places like the pin etc get confusing when all of a sudden you are no longer heading out of one port but in to another and you don't realise the markers are reversed..

If I don't know an area I am less inclined to power around at full speed just in case I do ground it.. nothing worse than coming to a grinding halt with the motor screaming at you and then having to try to pull or push the boat all the way back to deeper water again.

Even with local knowledge though things come unstuck... I recall once at Redcliffe in Mullet Creek (locals only generally go there and it may even now be a green zone :( ) I had been there many times before but went left of my usual track by about 15 feet.. was in my little tinnie with the dog hanging out the side when up the sand bar I went to a dead stop... I was plastered all over the wind screen and the poor dog did the superman thing out the side... poor bugger really didn't want to get back in the boat with me after that either haha

[dnej]

If in doubt, go as close to the becon as possible, and hope like heck the becon is in enough water. (Just kidding)
David

[Gazza]

RED=Port=LEFT , giveway to the Right , keep to the Right

Boats are like "traffic lights" i.e.
IF a boat is coming from the right , it's RED light is showing.....so stop/slowdown :stop: or go behind it.
IF a boat is coming from the Left.....GREEN light is showing.....proceed with caution/safety

If simply overtaking a boat , either side is o.k. , but pick the "deepest water" (shallow water is generally lighter in colour)

[Fed]

Places like the pin etc get confusing when all of a sudden you are no longer heading out of one port but in to another and you don't realise the markers are reversed..
I don't know the area at all but that sounds like a nightmare no wonder people are getting confused.