Using (not tying) Bimini Twist

[NormC]

I spend a fair bit of time in NT fishing - Barra, Threadies, Jacks etc. My most common set ups are:

When flicking lures for barra - 50 lb braid tied to 60 or 80 lb leader (5 ft max due to reel), then a Norman's Speed Clip or Cross Lock Clasp for connecting lure - not real happy with either, but yet to find something better. Also sometimes use a Jack Erskine Twisted leader made from 60 or 80 lb leader tied to braid. This gives a doubling of the leader over the last 30cm or so to the clasp.

When live baiting - 30 or 50 lb braid tied to 60 lb leader(about 8 ft). Running sinker on leader above swivel, 80 lb leader below to hook (about 40cm).

I'm happy, but always looking to improve. I've heard lots of comment on the Bimini Twist and how good and strong it is. I haven't tied one, but I'm sure it won't be an issue with practice.

What I'm interested in is how and why they are used. So I get a great strong loop in my line - what do I do with it? Given the type of fishing mentioned above, what benefit would I get and how would I get it?

Norm C

[Tim_N]

Norm,
The idea of doubling the mainline, braid especially, is to give the best advantage to the leader ie the braid not to cut into the leader, and also due to the doubling of the mainline surface area, increases the joining knot strength by a large margin.
The Bimini is like all knots and while people claim that it retains 100% of the strength of the mainline, it usually does not. There are a few guys I'm aware of who are very proficient at tying the Bimini, and they can usually achieve about 90%. These numbers have been tested professionally, and mine tests at about 70%.
The only way of getting really close to 100% consistently is to buy a Paulus Bimini Aid. Also, check out this site for heaps of information regarding lines, knot tests etc. It is a real eye opener and one where you can put a heap of ideas into practise to improve the most basic of fishing skills, staying connected.
http://www.pcwi.com.au/fishing/index.htm
The major benefit you would achieve by using a double, it to retain the maximum possible from your rigs, so you can put more pressure on fish and know wth a fair degree of confidence, that everything will and should hold together.
A double will also allow you to use things like wind on leaders like the Egrell style, the Knotted Dog type or the ever increasing number of other over the counter wind on's.
If you're a fan of the Improved Albright, the doubling of the braid helps enormously with regards to knot strength.
Braid, by nature, is quite abrasive and a single strand of it under pressure, can cut mono and flurocarbon leaders due to it being so thin. However, by doubling it up, this problem is all but eliminated and once where knots were coming apart under pressure from either a fish or even due to casting pressure, the entire rig is far more secure.
Really, considering the beasties you're targeting, I think by mastering the Bimini double, you will put the odds a lot more in your favour.
I hope this helps.
Tim

[NormC]

Thanks Tim. For joining leader to mainline, I use either Albright (modified by 3 winds through the leader loop and around main line to finish - is that Improved Albright?) or Slim Beauty. For either knot, I flatten the braid by running under finger nail, then double it for the knot.

So, if I'm understanding right, I think I get much of the first benefit you mention by this doubling.

Have never used 'wind on leaders' and don't know much about them, but will have a look to see if they are worth a try. I like to keep my rigs simple enough to be able to completely re-rig in the boat, which is only a 3.95 SeaJay (carried as roof topper).


The typical 'unexplained bust off' I experience has been with live bait (say 10 inch mullet) fishing around a snag with drag done up fairly tight (due to snag). Occasionally a monster hit will see a broken main line in the first second or two. I put this down to the 'shock' of the big hit, when some lines and knots will break well below their normal rated level. To overcome this, I've increased the length of the mono leader (normally 60 lb) to about 8 feet (to gain some stretch), with an 80 lb 'bite leader' below this connected via swivel. Not a lot of those 'monster hits' since then, so can't be sure of the outcome.

Thanks for your response.

Norm C

[Tim_N]

The way you tie your Albright is what I call an Improved Albright.
Also, by flattening the braid, you are giving it its best chance, but once your Albrights get above say 30 lb leaders, the knot strength diminishes markedly, well mine did anyway.
So, a well tied Bimini, tied by a Paulus Bimini Aid and then the Improved Albright will give you a better advantage. Better still try a wind on.
But all things considered, what you're doing is really quite good, just be careful when you up leader strength.
Tim

[PNG1M]

After living in PNG for several years and after numerous PNG Black Bass & Barra encounters I tried and tested several set-ups including twisted leaders, wind-ons & biminis.

The method I ended up with that was consistently reliable was straight forward is as follows (its a bit of the K.I.S.S. principle):

Mainline: 20kg (44lb) YGK Jigman

Leader: 60lb good quality mono or 50lb Seaguar flurocarbon (I interchanged between these but couldn't really distinguish any definite advantage for either)

KNOT 1: I settled on a single strand mainline (as above) direct to leader ALWAYS with a meticulously tied Albright with 20 tight wraps up and 20 wraps back - all nice and snug and even. Pull it up tight with some spit & you can trim the tag ends nice & close. I didn't use the modified albright - just the standard.

I made sure the knot stopped just above the reel with enough length hanging off the end of the rod for a good cast. Worked just fine, time and time again.

Some weekends I'd use the same leader & knot all weekend and a few times would start with it again next trip, maybe a month later.

KNOT 2: I didn't like the idea of using clips to attach lures. I also wanted to be able to change lures quickly while keeping the same leader intact. So I came up with the idea of tying a small NON-SLIP LOOP KNOT at the end of the leader with a small 80lb Black Crane swivel in the loop.

I'd then slide a size 5 Owner hyper-wire split ring onto the swivel and attach the lure to that. Get used to using a set of good quality split ring pliers and Bob's your uncle.

So why didn't I like the other leaders? Well, different strokes for different folks - each to their own and all that:

Bimini: Yep, I could tie them good n proper. Other blokes in the fishing club who did like using 'em often ask me to tie theirs. I found them to be too knotty and cluttery.

There was the rough end-section of the bimini at the main line end where the double started that I wasn't keen on and I found that tieing an albright into the double fattened up the leader knot too much, making things too bulky. So I opted out from the Bimini...

Twisted leaders: Naaa - similar reason to do with bulkiness. Tried the slim beauty that I found to be fatter than the albright. Went back to the albright and the knot was still too bulky for me.

Like my women, I prefer the slim, trim, smooth, streamlined, uncomplicated look with the lumps & bumbs in the right places - so the twisted leader just didn't do it for me.

I also tried the twisted leader via cats-paw to bimini set up but still didn't like it. And I couldn't use my non-slip loop knot idea on the end.

Wind-ons: I just didn't like the section of dacron going through the rod guides all the time. And it didn't look the part when wound on to the reel. And I could always see the dacron a mile off when winding in from clear water. I ended up snipping the dacron off and using the mono for regular leaders. It was schneider mono on the wind-ons (45lb and 60lb).


All personal choice I guess...it's what works for you!

[aussiebasser]

Harro's put a post on Sweetwater about the knot he's now using for tying heavy leaders to braid. Thre are instructions here:
http://www.sweetwaterfishing.com.au/Forum/index.php/topic,4779.0.html

With good knot tying and good quality braid, the bimini is almost redundent now.

[PNG1M]

I had a look at that knot on Sweetwater and it looks good. I'm gonna give it a burl or at least tie it to see how it looks & feels.

I wonder if any 'knot strength' tests have been done on it. Interesting to see that a doubled up mainline is used.

The knot should be a similar thickness to an albright given that the albright requires first winding the braid upwards then winding back down over the first layer, therefore creating a 'double' thickness.

Definately worth a try. Is it gonna be called the Harro Knot? Can't see why knot..!

[Horse]

That knot that Harro has come up with might just be the real thing. I believe in the KISS theory as I have seen more fancy doubles etc fail than basic knots. I use a single improved Albright and am quite happy but I do like Harros and will test it out

[Paulus]

Hi Guys
I just saw the knot on Sweetwater and i will give it a try, I am not much on single lines onto heavier leaders as they tend to fail early, but a knot that i have not tried is interesting, especially if its simple.
Paulus
just doing some tests.

[Paulus]

Hi Guys
When you find a knot that works for you that is what you use.

I have just just put up a new ending (tie off) system for the bimini that incorperates two legs instead of the one, its in PDF form and can be printed.

If your into using 54lb braid and 70 lb leader and want it to break at 25 lb then almost any knot will do that, but if you want to use a thinner 30 lb braid and you want 30 lb then its a different kettle of fish, your knots come into play.

I looked at that Knot and did a review.
Thanks
Paulus
http://www.pcwi.com.au/fishing/index.htm

[bigboss]

I stiil use the bimini for braid and mono it doesn take longer than 30 seconds and yes I do get over 90% breaking strain which is plenty considering my drag is at 50% so pull your head in boys its not breaking strain thats the problem its drag setting and snaggs.your not gonna fish 30lb with 13kg of drag are you.