What's borderline conditions for you?

[Scalem]

You have heard and seen it all before ... If in doubt don't go. But I am amazed at the varying degrees of weather patterns we have to deal with, and make a decision whether to go fishing or not, based on common sense, levels of experience, seaworthiness of the vessel you skipper, where you plan to go etc etc.

For some, the relaxation of boating is their way of keeping sane, so repeated bad weather weekend after weekend can become a little dissappointing to say the least, so judgement can become clouded over making the right decision to go or not. Sometimes I have been thinking it would be easier to stay home and become a couch potato watching the football, and I can't blame many who I class as "Gunna" fisherman who bail out of wetting a line at the slightest hint that conditions are not perfect, so they hardly ever go out as a result. On the other hand, there's those who have been out who claim they could surf the swell back home and come up with bags of fish.

Looking at the weather forecast for this weekend, the wind is tipping 20 knots, averaging 15 knots from the south, swell for offshore is still a bit high for my liking, Saturday is over 2 meters. In a 6 mtr boat, is this borderline or how many would go?

So here is the question. When conditions have been borderline such as this weekend, when have you ever been caught out and how did you handle the experience of making the wrong decision? Would you do it again? Share your experiences.

Interested to hear some views.

Scalem

[FNQCairns]

For me 2m swell + 15kn waves I would plan to stay at home, would happily come back home through it just wouldn't look forward to planing a day of fun in it.

cheers fnq

[Lucky_Phill]

Hi Brian,

This is a good question and I think been covered before but always good to get it up in the threads.

Basically, your guts will tell you. ..... gut feelings.... listen to them.

For me, it depends on whether I am crossing a bar or not.

At 1770 with bugga all bar and day of 20 knots and 1.5mtrs is going to be hard going but doable, if you are on limited time.

In the SEQ area and crossing bars I would reflect on 15knots and 1.2mtrs. Anything over that, I'll do some boat and reel maintenance. Bar crossing in " iffy ' conditions is another kettle of fish. Better to work the crossings around the making tide to avoid pressure waves etc.

It will all come down to experience or in-experience.

So, the question answered would be:-

10 - 15 NE / SE 1.2mtrs. anything under that and ya won't see me for ' seaspray '. :) :)

Then again, I have fished up the inside of Fraser for spottie mackerel in a " gale warning "...... was 30 knots plus SE, but inside was great. Until that last open water from Moon Point to Urangan.... doh ! AS stated, experience will help.



Phill
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[finga]

A serious fisho would find somewhere else to fish IF the outside predictions are not so flash.
As Phil mentioned the differences about bar work and wide open oceans and as you know we use the Evans bar a lot (exclusively) and if there is any doubt about the bar conditions either going out or for the return (this is where the predictions come in handy and local knowledge) we simply replace the rods with lighter ones and go fishing in the river instead.
For us if it's over 10-15kts and 1.2-1.5m predictions for later in the day or the tide is wrong for the return crossing .... we're in the river somewhere. (This would also depend on direction of all the above)
But as you know my experience is no where the level of most blokes here (after living in the area experiencing the weather patterns and watching the bar for 30 odd years and crossing the bar and getting to know the boat for another 8 years or so) we always ere on the side of caution.
We keep an eye out on the weather and we know where the crook weather comes from etc etc.
Why do we do this seeing the old Bertie will handle a lot more sever conditions??
Because I do not want to test the Bertie and we go fishing for relaxation and for the possibility of a fish tea..not to scare/worry the begeesus out of ourselves. If we wanted that we'd go to movie world....or worse...visit Joicey

We have been caught out once.
We got onto a school of yellow fin off Evans and whilst chasing them (or more exactly the birds) we did not see the weather coming in from the south.
Big mistake and one I will never make again.

Hi Brian,

This is a good question and I think been covered before but always good to get it up in the threads.

Basically, your guts will tell you. ..... gut feelings.... listen to them.


It will all come down to experience or in-experience.

Phill

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A lot of times people think they have the experience. But in reality this so called experience is a figment of their own minds.
A good example of this was that goose a couple of years ago off Mackay on the jetski. Rescued 3 times in 2 days wasn't it??
He thought he was good...the rest of us thought he was a moron

All of the following is my opinion...and mine alone...
If you have to ask if the conditions are OK then you should be staying at home.
If you have to ask then there are doubts and you should stay at home.
If you have to ask if your boat can handle the condition you should stay home

A true fisho will always find a spot to throw a line.
A person with a bit of common sense will not risk lives for a fish or two.
A goose will risk his, and others, lives for the possibility of a fish because this is his day off and he's going fishing in the ocean. And that's that.
There's a lot of gooses about. Just ask the VMR's, Coast Guards etc



:)

[trueblue]

the thing about marginal weather conditions is that you often get a window of opportunity

problem is, windows slam shut when the wind picks up

[lippa]

agree with fnq, that pulls me up, it is supposed to fun and relaxing out there!!!!!
the 5.2 kevlacat boys might handle 5mts and 50 knots, but somthing needs to be said about those boys sanity!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!lol

[Noelm]

there is lots of bits to all this, first off if it is rough, that is chop from all directions, wind and rain and all sorts of sh!t, then fishing in anything other than the USS Ronald Regan will be a pain, might be safe enough, but it will still be a crap day anyway, so stay home, now we have the big swell factor, sometimes the size of the swell means bugger all, might make a few seasick, but it probably will not "bite you" now make that same size swell all mixed up and breaking from wind and the whole ball game has changed big time! suddenly you are not going up and down, but you are surfing your way home, the question of bars comes up all the time, I have crossed a hundred different bars in all sorts of boats, and almost nothing in QLD can compare to a NSW bar on a nasty day, trust me on that one, sure some might be shallow and dodgey, but not to the extent of (say) Port Macquarie, or Narooma back a few years, now we have the question of time, some of us might be on holidays and only have a couple of days in a certain spot and will fish in sad conditions that you might have other wise not gone out in, it is your call, just use your judgement and don't take risks (well not big risks).

[thelump]

One thing to consider is where you are getting your information from. While seabreeze is OK for wind predictions I have found it crap for swell predictions. I have been out on days when seabreeze has called a 2m swell and it is dead flat. The reason I chose to venture out was that I look at wave cams on the Gold coast and check out Coastalwatch for swell conditions. This site is for surfers and is far more accurate than Seabreeze. Others in the club I am in were going to call off trips because of where they gathered their info. With all the information we have at hand these days it is pretty easy to make an informed decision on going fishing. Just my two bobs worth.
Cheers Jason

[finding_time]

Scalem

I'm planning to go on Sunday, weather looks good atm! As far as what i'll fish in goes that depends on the reason and is it worth being uncomfortable for!! Imho most boats will out perform there skippers, thats to say the crew will want to go home long before the boats capabilitys are really tested( provided it a good boat up to the task of offshore fishing) I guess it depends on how uncomfortable you want to be before the rewards of fishing dont seem so high!

Ian

Ps The above comments dont refer to coastal bars and these have to be assessed on the day, whether they be the QLD bars or those incredibly nasty NSW ones!!::)

[Jeremy]

guess it depends on whether you are talking borderline for comfort or borderline for safety?

Like everyone else, I enjoy fishing most when seas are flat, but will head offshore in 15 knot breeze and swell <2m if I am keen.

I think the question of boats and safety offshore has been well covered in some recent threads, so I wil leave that one.

Jeremy

[Crunchy]

Bit new to all this but swell seems to me to be not such a problem (Unless crossing a bar) isn't wind and chop the emeny? Yesterday I had the same decision...go out or not..the swell was still coming in quite large sets but "abating during the day" according to BOM....went down to the bar for a look and thought, "Nup, a few curly ones coming in out the back, it doesn't feel right". But the sea looks good so I'll go out through M/Bar, once out there the conditions were great. But I did think geez one of these swells might just break on this shallow reef!

[rosco1974]

15-20knts and 2mtr swells if fishing off the gc seaway but if going throught the southpassage bar 15 knts and 1.7mtrs swell
cheers rosco

[Snapp.]

Hi guys
I have a 5m center consol. I will head over to moreton in 15kt winds, any rougher then that and i simply fish elsewhere. It's pretty easy to find shelter around any of the bay islands. If i was to take it to the top of moreton or outside would generally depend on the day. I'm usually at moreton for sunrise and if the day seems ok.. I'm there. I've grown up with boats all my life, as have alot of us. I just had my 23rd birthday and for a younger bloke have a good level of common sence and certain respect for the ocean. I remember being out at the barwon banks as a kid, we were staying out overnight. I was with my gradfather in his 625 cruiscraft. Overnight the seas picked up and it was that rough that he couldnt read the gps, i was probably 15 and was thrown in the hot seat to get us back to mooloolaba. Shit it was rough that night, waves were crashing over the boat and all. (i've loved boats ever since) LOL. but anyway for a younger block i have a level of experience that you dont get overnight. Its all about observing whether patterns, learning to read forcasts, common sence, experience and formost having correct safety gear to fulfill you obligations for worst case senarios.
'A weekend at home is better then not coming home at all'
Regards Matt

[honda900]

Scalem,

as you build confidence in the Yalta you will find it will handle the conditions well, Bill Cortens bar crossing course is also a personal confidence builder and teaches you boat handling. Toghether you will find (with time) a medium between what you will do and the boat will do.

Swell is Ok but, wind and swell make for an uncomfortable days fishing. Me I will fish up to 10knots in a 2 mtr swell. outside, after that it becomes hard work, and would be more fun to bash around the bay or stay home.

Regards
Honda.

[RAT-KING]

I believe unless the forcast is a definate no, there's no harm in having a look, just make sure u know wat the arvo forcast is, many a time ive headed down the goldy wen the forcast has bn iffy (in my 4.1) and had a look at the bar and its bn great so make the cross and had a great days fishing, but ofcourse ive arrived and bn forced to fish in the seaway, once again it comes down to confidence, knowing the area ur fishing and if it looks good but the forcast is average u dont have to go out 2 the 50's just hang around close so if it turns to crap its only a small trip back in. the goldy 4 my little boat its 1.5m 15knt but bn out in 2m+ a few times the bay anything over a meter ill fish the river.
Cheers Simon

[robersl]

I don't fish outside but i fish the bay if the prediction is for 10-15 kn it is workable a as long as the sea's are under .7 on moreton bay even .7 id ugly near the shipping channel in a 4.2 m tinnie and i would go up pumicestone passage for a fish instead i try to get a fish in at least 1 day over the weekend as a rule i also check the weather chart to see where the high's and low's are located before making a final decision

shane

[Swindells]

In my 12ftr i'm somewhat of a skittish cat, if one of the crew farts i have the anchor in before he's finished, i've heard too many stories of overconfident boaties going swimming because of poor judgement. In the 5.3 we've more confidence. it's a case of know your boat and area.

In bundy i take the 12ftr across a shallow bar and head a click offshore to a reef that i've been fishing since i was three but i know the area, i check the reports and keep an eye on the weather, i know exactly how long it takes me to get shoreside in what seas. in the moreton bay i don't have as much experience so i'll come in when it gets choppy.

Cheers.

[PeaJay]

G'day Scalem

Chris Ryan's brother in law here. Being a surfer my whole life helps in depicting what the real wave heights are going to be. As stated before by anouther poster, coastalwatch.com.au is a very good guide and you can check the Seaway condition too. Seabreeze you can cut the predicted wave heights in half for the wave face sizes on the beach.

Here is what the wave size are predicted to be like over the coming days:

Friday
Building S swell. 1 to 2ft+ across the exposed northern NSW coast early, with potential for some 3ft (3ft+) sets in the afternoon, most of the swell bypassing the Gold Coast. SSW winds 10 to 20 knots.

Saturday
S swell. 3 to 4ft across the exposed northern NSW coast, smaller inside bays and points. S winds 10 to 15 knots early, tending light SE in the afternoon.

Sunday
Weak S/SE swell. Dropping back to 1 to 2ft across the open beaches, smaller inside bays and points. NW to N winds 5 to 15 knots.

From the look of that, I would say that from Sat evening high tide, through to the high the next morning will be fantastic fishing, weather condition wise. I'm going to attack it on Saturday night, have an overnighter in the Broadwater and head straight out the Seaway at first light. If I had a bigger boat (currently have a 4.8 model, I'de be outside overnight).

Enjoy.

PJ

[Scalem]

In my 12ftr i'm somewhat of a skittish cat, if one of the crew farts i have the anchor in before he's finished,

Cheers.

Swindells,

Let me be the 2nd person to every thank you since joining AF, that is a good laugh right there buddy, looking forward to seeing your posts in the future M8, I better look now see who thanked you the 1st time, it's bound to be just as hilarious!!;D;D;D

G'day Scalem

Chris Ryan's brother in law here.
PJ


Great to make your aquaintance. He has spoken about you B4, I wonder if you also have the family underarm "flick" of the rod that Chris has which comes from overcrowded family fishing excursions:-X;D;D As per usual I am committed Sunday, but I just had another look at the weather and you are right, you will have perfect conditions. 12 hours too late for me unfortunately.

To the rest I have read your replies, thanks. Just a couple of comments. Phil, thanks M8, I agree the subject has been covered over the years, As moderator I wonder if you put you mind to it, would there be any topic that has never been covered in some point in time on AF? Maybe that's why Charleville gets so creative with his posts?? :P Wait a minute, even Bruce is a bit quiet these days!::)
The northern waters you refer to Phil can be very different as I found in Hervey bay. The old Mustang seemed to be giving me a rough ride even in glassed out conditions with short swells rolling through that forced me to keep the speed right down.

Finga - A couple of things I agree and diagree with - Joicy is not that bad, we were going to compare olds a while ago weren't we? I'd have you crying for mercy, guaranteed!! ;D When you say If you have to ask then there are doubts and you should stay at home. If you have to ask if your boat can handle the condition you should stay home There will always be times of uncertainty, even for the experienced. It's like the case of young school leavers applying for work and requirements are for "previous experience required" There is only one way to get experience, and that's to get out there and NIKE.

Honda, you might be thinking I need more confidence?? That's the problem. Ive got buckets of confidence, but little experience in places like SPBar. Deadly combination hey?;) If you count the number of hours I have been behind the controls of a boat, I might surprise many, but my confidence has got me in some tight spots I would rather forget, which has given me more respect and to ease back a bit and try to reason through every boating situation I come across.

Scalem

[sleepygreg]

With those intentions Scalem you will do ok. You have a very seaworthy boat now, which should be able to handle MOST conditions you are likely to encounter in and outside the bay. Despite what anyone says, bar crossings are a lottery.....the more tickets you have the better your chances (ie..the more experience/knowledge you have the better your chances are). You have displayed the most important aspect of skippering a boat.....respect for the sea, quest for knowledge, awareness of limitations.

Going back to Noelms post......I remember watching videos of members of the Port Stephens Game Club surfing the bar in their 35 - 45' game boats off Port Stephens in '84. 5-6m swells but smooth conditions. From a distance these boats looked like tinnies playing in the river mouth. We were out the same day in our 4.5m lazeabout tinnie......didnt even realise the swells were that big.....till we came back into the port. When your are blissfully motoring towards your destination and you feel the boat surging forward, then look back and see a wall of water that seems to be the height of a block of flats behind you and starting to break.....your instincts from years of boating kick in.....in this case we 'surfed the tube' til the swell rolled under us. (a few sailing tricks were employed instinctively, ie crew hanging over the side off the rocket launchers when the boat started broaching). These things are instinctive once experience is gained...and we had all fished off this boat since new, in many conditions.

A lot of it comes down to what you want out of your boating experience. In those days we were competition motivated.......Game and Sportfishing competitions were what we did. These days I do the odd Game comp, but mostly I prefer to just go catch a feed, albeit still with the balance of fairness to the fish. But I am not interested in being bashed around the boat, and coming home with bumps and bruises all over just to catch a fish. Yep....I am getting soft....but have been doing this for 40 years...so time to slow down a bit.

I suppose what I am getting at is......you decide what you are comfortable trying to handle.....be that safety wise or comfort wise....you are no dill when it comes to knowledge of the bay and what it can serve up. try taking the boat out on some not so good days (I dont mean full blown fishing trips) around the bay just to see how it handles in adverse conditions (and how YOU can handle it). We used to do this regularly in the club I was with in the early days...so the guys could learn their boats (and their own) capabilities with other boats around to keep things safe.

Greg

[Swindells]

Thanks Scalem,

Confusious say - the most wasted day of all, is one in which we have not smiled.

he also say - before you judge a man, walk a mile in his shoes, that way, when you judge him, your a mile away, and you have his shoes.

Cheers.

Swindells