Grassies, OK I'm confused???

[castlemaine]

Fisheries regulations ...
All Sweetlip (excluding Red Throat Sweetlip), 25cm min., 5 per species
All Emperors, 25cm min, 5 per species
Red Throat Sweetlip, 38cm min, limit 8
Grass Emperor (Grass Sweetlip), 30cm min, No limit

My question is what species is often caught off the Peel, Green and Mud Islands that's commonly called Grassies?

I can't seem to find a definitive photo of the fish.

I'm a bit confused and if anyone can shed some light on this I'd really appreciate it.

When is an Emperor a Sweetlip?
Cheers 8-)

[Outsider1]

They are Grass Sweetlip castlemaine. They are also sometimes called Grass Emperor, and the Emperor name tends to be used on some of the other Sweetlips too eg Yellow Sweetlip/Spangled Emporer.

Here are some links with photos;

http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/vbpicgallery.php?do=big&p=206

http://www.fish.gov.au/fishnames/fishnames.php?pid=2768

http://www.sunfish.com.au/html/grass_sweetlip.html

Cheers

Dave

[webby]

Grass Sweetlip come under the inshore finfish rules, whilst all others come under coral reef regs.
at present grassies are 30cm no limit, about to change to 30cm limit of 10.
The other common sweetlip in the bay is the spangled/yellow or spangled emperor 45cm size limit of 5.
regards

[gogetter]

whats the main feature that of a grassie compared with a red throat????

not a trick question

[Outsider1]

whats the main feature that of a grassie compared with a red throat????

not a trick question

Hi gogetter,

Red Throat are fairly easy to distinguish, its the red LOL;

http://www.sea-ex.com/fishphotos/emperor,.htm

"Red-Throat Emperors are reddish orange around their eyes with a red patch at the base of the pectoral fin, and a bright red dorsal fin."

Not having a shot mate , but I think the confusion is usually between the Grassy Sweetlip and the Yellow Sweetlip or Spangled Emperor, not the Red Throat. They can look very similar, particularly in younger fish.

http://www.sea-ex.com/fishphotos/sweetlip1.htm

Here is what Ern Grant says (of the Grass Sweetlip);

"....The olive cheeks are densely speckled in white. All fins are pinkish, except the blue-edged pectorals; the tail is pink, with paler bars and spots. It is a good diagnostic character that a pattern of fine blue pencil-lines radiates from the eye across the snout and the upper regions of the face. Even in the largest fish, these narrow lines never develop as broad blue bars that run to the mouth and throat- a character that separates the Grass Sweetlip from the Yellow Sweetlip."

Hope that helps.

Cheers

Dave

[Scott nthQld]

gogetter, a fail safe way is to look down their gob. A red throat will (as the name says) have a bright red inside of its mouth and down it throat, where as in the grassy won't. I use this because somethimes I find in smaller fish the colouration is very similar and hard to distinguish between the 2 species.

[gogetter]

gogetter, a fail safe way is to look down their gob. A red throat will (as the name says) have a bright red inside of its mouth and down it throat, where as in the grassy won't. I use this because somethimes I find in smaller fish the colouration is very similar and hard to distinguish between the 2 species.

scott,

the grassy still has a red mouth..??... but is the greeny blue colour on the body...

shane :-/

[gogetter]

Hi gogetter,

Red Throat are fairly easy to distinguish, its the red LOL;

http://www.sea-ex.com/fishphotos/emperor,.htm

"Red-Throat Emperors are reddish orange around their eyes with a red patch at the base of the pectoral fin, and a bright red dorsal fin."

Not having a shot mate , but I think the confusion is usually between the Grassy Sweetlip and the Yellow Sweetlip or Spangled Emperor, not the Red Throat. They can look very similar, particularly in younger fish.

http://www.sea-ex.com/fishphotos/sweetlip1.htm

Here is what Ern Grant says (of the Grass Sweetlip);

"....The olive cheeks are densely speckled in white. All fins are pinkish, except the blue-edged pectorals; the tail is pink, with paler bars and spots. It is a good diagnostic character that a pattern of fine blue pencil-lines radiates from the eye across the snout and the upper regions of the face. Even in the largest fish, these narrow lines never develop as broad blue bars that run to the mouth and throat- a character that separates the Grass Sweetlip from the Yellow Sweetlip."

Hope that helps.

Cheers

Dave

but Dave does the grassie still have a red throat???:-/

[Scott nthQld]

sorry, bit ambiguos there, no, the grassy doesn't have the red inside its mouth and its throat, well not with my experience anyway.

[gogetter]

scott,

send me your email addy and i'll send you a pick of my grassie..

[gogetter]

sorry, bit ambiguos there, no, the grassy doesn't have the red inside its mouth and its throat, well not with my experience anyway.

Scott,

thats what i thought but, the decky on the Jillan 2(charter boat that i went out on over xmass) says that its a grassie and it had a red mouth and a little way down its throat.:-/

[JSY]

This is slightly off the topic but may provide a bit of insight. Multiple common names for a single species is usually the main reason for confusion in fish identification, particularly when in comes to figuring out what species the legislation is referring to. Scientifically speaking, the term ‘emperors’ refers to fish in the family Lethrinidae and includes commonly caught species such as grass emperor, red throat emperor and spangled emperor (commonly referred to as sweetlip by many). The term ‘sweetlips’ refers to the blubbery lipped species within the family ‘Haemulidae’ and includes species such as the mother-in-law or slatey bream, and gold-spot sweetlip or netted sweetlip.

When the legislation refers to fish such as red emperor (family Lutjanidae, the ‘snappers’), and snapper (Sparidae, the ‘sea breams’) and grass sweetlip (Lethrinidae), it does tend to throw a bit of a spanner in the works! The problem is compounded when you start trying to figure out the some of the alternate and bizarre common names that some anglers give to commonly caught species.

JSY

[disorderly]

Shane, in a post from Outsider above it mentions the blue lines on the face of the grassy.These will be even more pronounced in the Spangler and non-existant in the Red throat..this makes it easy to differentiate the grassy from the red throat.
I think also that perhaps the sweetlip has more of a bream type shape and the red throat a slighly more pointy nose....(often with a red gob..hence the namehttp://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/../yabbfiles/Templates/Forum/default/rolleyes.gif)

scott

[gogetter]

trying to upload pic

[gogetter]

trying to upload pic


whats it look like???:-/

[jackscatch]

That looks like a
grassy

[Outsider1]

I would say that is a Grassy gogetter, definitely not a Red Throat (no red on the fins etc, see my earlier post). The Brown tinges on and around the fins and head are another feature of the Grassy.

Cheers

Dave

[Scott nthQld]

I would go the other way, I would call it a red throat, the blue around it eyes is not very prominent and I think the fins have a slight reddishness about them. I also notice the absence of the blue on the pectoral fins that is present in a grassy.

Like I said, its sometimes harder to distinguish between the 2 species when they are smaller, hence why I take a look down its throat. If its red, I call it a red throat and follow the regs accordingly (38cm min), at least this way, if you are wrong you know that the red throat has a larger minimum size than the grassy and you don't have to worry abut getting pinged for it.

[dfox]

That pic is 100% grassy. Many members of the sweetlip family have red in there mouth. Its way safer to carefully study the exterior colourations to identify between species ...

[dfox]

Scott, instead of just looking in the mouth to tell if its a red throat, its much safer to also check out whether the base of the pectoral fin is red. If it aint red its not a red throat.
As ive already said many members of the family (Lethrinus) have red mouths and many do resemble one another to a degree, the grassy (Lethrinus laticaudis) and the spangled emperor also called the yellow sweetlip (Lethrinus nebulosus) can be the most confusing to distingish. Both have blue lines that radiate below the eye. The grassy usually has much finer blue lines and they never extend to the mouth, it also has white spots on the cheeks. The blue lines on the spangled are usually broader and extend to the mouth. Theres a number of other differences, but these formulars should get you by ...foxy

[jtpython]

The grassy has a red throat as well scott
Redthroat Emps Have the red head and are excellent eating
The pic with me holding the single fish is a grassy
and the pic with the fish on table is an actual Ausfish members pic that i borrowed to show if you look at bottom of table there are some amazing redthroat there
And me holding the two fish are spangleds
And the pic of just the 3 fish are redthroat

[warti]

24646Good photos there alright. Heres another on where you can tell the difference.Grassy middle left and redthroat on the right of it.

[Horse]

Last year we had at least one post of a fish with both Grassy and Spangly characteristics. Maybe a hybrid sp

[gogetter]

by the look pics the red throat pics they have a pointer head...... and the decky on jillian swore that grasy's have red throats too...... to date i have been doing just what scott says.... only keep em at 38min.... been throwing a lot of 35 and 36's back..... and some days that amounts top a lot of fillets....

thanks for all the coments guys and is a good help.

[castlemaine]

Thanks guys, I don't feel so stupid asking the question now.
Cheers 8-)