Navionics Cards - perennial question

[quigley595]

Probably asked a million times already.... and certainly by myself before, but I thought I would ask again.

I have the Navionics SD map card, and a single slot GPS. I like to log my sonars, and preferably look at the map at the same time.

So, I want to copy the map card (125 mb) onto a bigger card (1 gb). I dont even want to keep the original card, I just want more storage.... so I am NOT looking to pirate the Navionics maps, just get them onto a bigger card so that I can log data and still be able to use the maps.

All i want to do is to go out in the boat, read the maps while I am logging my sonars. I am not a pirate, I don't want to make money out of this....

Can anyone help me?

Mike

[TheRealAndy]

I have the same question myself and could get no answers off the web. So today I decided to start resarching SD cards and how they work. I am considering buying the navplanner software too. If I have the navplanner software I can reverse engineer how it all works and will be able to do it myself. Hopefully navionics will answer the email i sent today regarding upgrading the card to a larger card and I will not have to waste time working out how to do it myself! Will let you know the outcome.

[quigley595]

I have the same question myself and could get no answers off the web. So today I decided to start resarching SD cards and how they work. I am considering buying the navplanner software too. If I have the navplanner software I can reverse engineer how it all works and will be able to do it myself. Hopefully navionics will answer the email i sent today regarding upgrading the card to a larger card and I will not have to waste time working out how to do it myself! Will let you know the outcome.

hi Andy...... I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for Navionics! I talked with them a while ago on this question.... told them I would be prepared to:
send my original map card to them
send my own 1gb SD card
send some payment
and let them keep the original cardas I said.. I an not interested in pirating software... just to get the maps on a bigger card.

They came off with the usual speil.... cant be done, no way, no how.... sorry. You can buy the latest upgrade for $xxx but it is still only a 250 mb card....

So... here I am still trying to find a way....

Mike

[peterbo3]

Hi Guys,
The chart card & the marks are two different dogs. I am sure that Satnav will provide the technical details but basically you do not download your marks onto the Navionics or any other type card. You load them into the plotter & they are overlaid onto the chart info.
If you want a newer chart then send the card back for a paid update but, in reality, do you update your paper charts annually with a new one as opposed to working off "Notices to Mariners".
Quig, back up your plotter by downloading your marks onto a blank card but do not try to get "into"your map card. You will just stuff it.

[TheRealAndy]

Hi Guys,
The chart card & the marks are two different dogs. I am sure that Satnav will provide the technical details but basically you do not download your marks onto the Navionics or any other type card. You load them into the plotter & they are overlaid onto the chart info.
If you want a newer chart then send the card back for a paid update but, in reality, do you update your paper charts annually with a new one as opposed to working off "Notices to Mariners".
Quig, back up your plotter by downloading your marks onto a blank card but do not try to get "into"your map card. You will just stuff it.

But if you want to log sonar readings and screen shots you need an SD Card. Problem is that the SD card slot is used by the navionics card which only has limited amount of memory.

I am a bit nervous about playing around with the navionics card as I think the SD cards may have the capability of erasing themselves under certain conditions. Would be a bit crook if I lost $350 of maps. The other problem with SD cards is they have a secure section of memory that is password protected, and I dare say this is where the navionics secrets hide.

[peterbo3]

Andy, when you remove the card the marks are still in the plotter memory. No new info is put onto the Navionics card. The marks will show up on your screen with the card out & only the background chart showing.
Insert a new blank card & download the marks. What do mean by "screen shots"?

[TheRealAndy]

The response from Navionics:
You should use a separate card anyway. When you save the files to the Navionics card you will destroy the format and need to buy a new chart. Save the sonar files on a different card. The GPS still works without the chart in there.

Peter, with the lowrance sounder I have the option of saving of sonar traces to SD Card, likewise the sounder has the option of taking screen shots (whilst not as useful as a soanar trace they have their place). I am ot talking about waypoints, as these consume stuff all space and as you say can be saved to the unit itself.

[peterbo3]

Hi Andy,
With you now. What value are the sonar traces to you & how do you utilize them?

[TheRealAndy]

Great learning tool, also you can use them to analyze the surface of your favourite fishing spots when you are back home. You would be amazed at what detail you can salvage from traces when you are not sitting on top of meter of swell!

[quigley595]

Great learning tool, also you can use them to analyze the surface of your favourite fishing spots when you are back home. You would be amazed at what detail you can salvage from traces when you are not sitting on top of meter of swell!

Exactly andy..... I take a log of all the spots I fish.. then when I get back home, I look at them closely... amazing what you can find sitting at your desk.
Thats why I wanted to log the sonars.....

As for saving the sonar logs to the map card.... you can do this without harming the map card in any way.,... I have done it many times. The only problem, as per my first note, is that the card simply isn't big enough!

But back to the question..... I still havent found an answer.... any ideas???

Mike

[TheRealAndy]

Exactly andy..... I take a log of all the spots I fish.. then when I get back home, I look at them closely... amazing what you can find sitting at your desk.
Thats why I wanted to log the sonars.....

As for saving the sonar logs to the map card.... you can do this without harming the map card in any way.,... I have done it many times. The only problem, as per my first note, is that the card simply isn't big enough!

But back to the question..... I still havent found an answer.... any ideas???

Mike

Well if someone is willing to sacrafice a card I am willing to have a go at accessing it!!! Have you ever managed to copy the map files off the card and onto your PC?

[TheRealAndy]

Actually, what I would need is 2 copies of the exact same revision map, off 2 different cards. Unlikely to get this!

[ozbee]

navonics card is hard-wired differently to the standard off the shelf card great to be so big . not programming but actual circuity .

[TheRealAndy]

navonics card is hard-wired differently to the standard off the shelf card great to be so big . not programming but actual circuity .

This is incredibly unlikely. I can put a normal SD card in to my plotter and it works. IF it were wired differently then the plotter would have issues with one or the other. From my brief research today, what SD cards do provide is the ability for one to define a custom protocol. I doubt this is the case either, as I have read that people have successfully read the maps off the card. There is some suggestion that the map is linked to the unique ID on the card, and if this is the case it would be proven by taking 2 copies of the the same revision map and comparing them, as I suggested earlier.

[quigley595]

This is incredibly unlikely. I can put a normal SD card in to my plotter and it works. IF it were wired differently then the plotter would have issues with one or the other. From my brief research today, what SD cards do provide is the ability for one to define a custom protocol. I doubt this is the case either, as I have read that people have successfully read the maps off the card. There is some suggestion that the map is linked to the unique ID on the card, and if this is the case it would be proven by taking 2 copies of the the same revision map and comparing them, as I suggested earlier.

Andy, I have been able to copy the map files to a hard disk, and also to another SD card, but the GPS still won't read the files that were copied onto the new SD card..... Cant understand this, I know SD cards have a unique ID, but there must be something simple to do... every GPS unit wouldnt have a list of SD card ids???

There is a simple way to do this.... we just need to find it.

Mike

[ozbee]

navonics cards are widely used in the aircraft industry they are a very big company.my son who is a computer engineer says you wont succeed ,plotter will read more than one version of sd card. note we are talking about the actual program of the chip not the data stored on the chip.the downside is when you want a upgrade and you send in your chip the company throws yours in the bin and issues you a new one even it cant access it to up date it.

[FrankFWM]

Navionics need to step up to the plate and offer a solution - even if it is a small additional cost to get a 1Gb version...

[r3volt]

Wheres the cheapest place in aus to buy navionics cards?

[honda900]

[edit (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Secure_Digital_card&action=edit&section=8)] DRM features

The digital rights management (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_rights_management) scheme embedded in the SD cards is defined as the Content Protection for Recordable Media (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Content_Protection_for_Recordable_Media) (CPRM) by the 4C Entity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4C_Entity) and is centered around use of the Cryptomeria cipher (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptomeria_cipher) (also known as C2). The specification is kept secret and is only accessible to licensees. DVD-Audio (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD-Audio) uses a very similar scheme known as Content Protection for Prerecorded Media (CPPM). This type of DRM is associated with the reclusive SDMI (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SDMI), an organisation set up by the RIAA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RIAA) to promote such hardware-based copy protection schemes. Many SD cards are marked on the packaging as being 'SDMI Compliant' for this reason. This DRM has not been seen "in the wild" and few, if any, devices appear to provide support for it.
Super*Talent, a manufacturer of computer memory, has created the "Super Digital" card. They are the same in appearance and function to regular Secure Digital cards, but they lack the CPRM code commonly found in Secure Digital cards. [9] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secure_Digital_card#cite_note-8)

Regards
Honda

[TheRealAndy]

[edit (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Secure_Digital_card&action=edit&section=8)] DRM features

The digital rights management (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_rights_management) scheme embedded in the SD cards is defined as the Content Protection for Recordable Media (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Content_Protection_for_Recordable_Media) (CPRM) by the 4C Entity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4C_Entity) and is centered around use of the Cryptomeria cipher (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptomeria_cipher) (also known as C2). The specification is kept secret and is only accessible to licensees. DVD-Audio (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD-Audio) uses a very similar scheme known as Content Protection for Prerecorded Media (CPPM). This type of DRM is associated with the reclusive SDMI (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SDMI), an organisation set up by the RIAA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RIAA) to promote such hardware-based copy protection schemes. Many SD cards are marked on the packaging as being 'SDMI Compliant' for this reason. This DRM has not been seen "in the wild" and few, if any, devices appear to provide support for it.
Super*Talent, a manufacturer of computer memory, has created the "Super Digital" card. They are the same in appearance and function to regular Secure Digital cards, but they lack the CPRM code commonly found in Secure Digital cards. [9] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secure_Digital_card#cite_note-8)

Regards
Honda

Navionics dont use the DRM features ;)