Trip from hell

[indy]

Gday

Wasn't going to post but i thought i would give a heads up for fellow ausfishers.

Chris and I headed up to mooloolabha on sunday midmorning with plans on doing and overnighter at the banks area.

We had a slow run out to our first mark with conditions still fairly swelly with a bit of chop on it which seemed to take for ever.

We finally arrived on our spot and had a quick fish only getting a legal parrot so it was time to move a bit wider in search on some snapper. We started the motor and away we went following outsiderskip (pete) and spiro (chris) running another 11 klms north arriving at some new grounds we hadn't fished before sounded around found some fish on the sounder and droped the pick, we ended up miss judging the drift and landed of the ground so we decided to have another go at it.

Went to fire the motor up but there was nothing there that's not real good i say to chris the motor isn't firing thinking that it may have still been slightly in gear, no not that either oh sh*t, at this stage we are 50 odd klms of shore, gave pete outsiderskip a quick call not to go anywhere just in case we couldn't get it going, of comes the cowl to have a look an see if we can see anything wrong and the starter motor isn't coming up with any reel speed and when we go to crank it smoke is coming out of the bottom of it.

We thought it may have been the battery so i grab the brand new one from the front of the boat swapped them around but that also did nothing so by this stage we have tryed three different battery's in all differnt configurations so we are thinking the starter motor has gone. We tryed putting a piece of rope around the fly wheel and manually starting it but not a hope in hell being a 140 horsepower and no slot to put any rope into it just kept slipping of.

Chris and pete come over to lend a hand but they also had no luck with it trying various things to help not to no avail, thanks again guys.

Had to make a call to coast guard mooloolabha which where very helpfull cant thank them enough. They come out about three hours after the call was made throwing us a tow line and towing us back in at a steady 20 to 25 klms an hour back to harbour taking just on three hours. If any of the crew from coast guard are reading this thanks again on a very professional job and an excellent tow in.

Just thought i would also say that if you arn't a member of the coast guard it would pay you to belong as it is only a small fee of around 50 dollars and it would be alot cheaper in the long run as there running cost are $140 an hour and my rescue took me 5.5 hours costing $770 dollars, although they are a non profit organisation they like you to help out with there fuel costs which i will be gladly doing. Money will be coming shortly.


My motor is a 2003 model serviced regularly so it just goes to show it can happen to anyone of us.


Thanks again to all who helped

Any here is the colprete

[BR65]

Nasty one Indy, one thing you cant do is get out and walk 50kms off shore.
Good advice on joining the coast guard
cheers
brian

[baitwaster]

It's a shocker of a feeling when the donk won't fire. 50 Km/s out would make it ten times worse. Let us know how you go/ what's wrong with motor. Bet you were happy to get your feet on the dry after that one.

[TCSunCoast]

Indy

Good to hear you got back safely. Good advice regarding the coast gaurd, I'm a member and you get your own log in number + they have all your vehicle details on the bank, which ramp you go from etc etc. When I logged off on Sunday arvo they were going out for thier 4th tow. Certainly a great service that everyone should be part of.

I am dissapointed to here a fellow Suzuki owner was in trouble, I have a 6m Stringray that has had Suzuki's on it all its life and was just fitted with a new 140 4 stroke. Was it the starter? and were you told this was normal or just a one off thing?

Tony

[Frank OO]

Hi Indy,

I would be really interested to find out what the trouble was..

Frank OO

[Pistol_P]

mmm shocking trip alright....Thats a long wait and a long trip back.

Bad luck....:(

Pete

[seapup]

Hi Pete,
I know how you feel - same thing happened to me 3 years ago on the Hards. Headed out 40 mile early and came back in to 35 mile grounds off Noosa and bagged on Snapper and Pearlies. When I went to fire the engine up to pull up the pick it wouldnt start. We did same as you - swapping batteries around, tapping on starter motor - tried pull starting the 200hp Yammy but I snapped the cord first pull! A local pro heard me call the coast guard and he came down to try and help but we couldnt fire her over. He anchored next to me for 5 hours until the Noosa Coast Guard got to us - it took them so long to come out as they had to wait for enough water on the bar to cross. I definitely agree with you about how professional the Coast Guards are and that they make you feel safe out at sea. The $50 membership fee is definitely worth it!
Hope the engine repairs dont cost to much and you are back on the water in no time!
Cheers and Happy New Year 2008,
Benny.

[rocksberg6]

I know how you feel INDY we were towed in sunday ourselves. We left the coast guard ramp at 0400 and headed out around wide caloundra for the morning,back to the blinker (which is gone by the way) fished the gneerings till 0900, getting alot of little stuff decided to have a troll around old womens on the way home, picked up a nice kingy and then took the run back to the harbour. Just as we were lining up our run back through the entrance (which is bloody shallow at the moment) we must have bottomed out and spun the prop on the mercruiser.In the middle of the bar, and no drive! Oh what a feeling! We called coast guard and they were there within 10 mins had us tied along side (no time to tow through)and brought us back in. If anyone from VMR Mooloolaba is out there thanks again. I renew my membership every year for both boats and this is the first time i have needed there assistance, But if they were'nt there sunday Barcardi 2 would be a 8-5m fad on the inner rockwall at mooloolaba. Once again thanks guys on all that you do.

Troy.

[indy]

My mates brother come around today who is an auto electrician and had a look at the starter motor for me and he pulled it apart and the bushes are gone in it.

Hopefully i will be able to get away with about $150 to $250 dollars for the fix.

Thanks for all your comments

cheers pete...

[Dean1]

Thats a bummer pete.. Like you say you never know do you. I guess thats where twin outboards are a big advantage. Just another plus of owning a cat ;D Hope you have better luck next trip mate, take it easy. Deano.

[outsiderskip]

hi pete
brushes dont cost that much
go buy them and fit them yourself
pete

[indy]

TCSUNCOAST

We ended up taking it of when my mates brother was here the auto electrician, so i can't tell you wether this is common in them as i am getting it fixed by an auto electrician.

OUTSIDERSKIP

That price is to get it fully rebuilt don't want that happening again not just the bushes.

[Jeremy]

like to know where they get $140 ph and $770 total from? Having a lend of you (and everyone) I feel. Do they charge for wages for the crew also?

If you have insurance, you will probably find that your policy covers you for the fee anyway.

Jeremy

[T1]

Hey Pete

Unlucky mate! But have to agree about the cost of joining! It's similiar to having RACQ cover except MORE essential in my opinion - unless you like swimming...

I recall breaking down at the Pin bar 2 yrs ago and they wanted $100/hr from when they launch. Now some may think that's excessive but it's not if you don't have a choice! Even better is that for $55, you're covered!

JEREMY, you have to take into perspective that they are purely volunteer and they have a significant cost base to run their operations - this has to be covered somehow. It sh#ts me to tears that valuable essential services like this and lifesaving have to be left to volunteers - while the government coffers waste our taxes on non-essentials!

Take Care T

[4x4frog]

Good to here you were able to return home safely Indy.
Rebuilding the starter is a good idea too.
You need to keep a wireless laptop on board and you could have given us a minute by minute update;D




$770, $77,000, what price do you put on life?
I don't think any type of synicism or judgemental comments are needed, the Coastguard and VMR are an excellent and very selfless service, I don't think comments like these are warrented

[-spiro-]

Not the best day hey Pete. I am pretty sure that the brush's are cheep. I don't think you need a full rebuild as you would go through 2-3 sets of brushs before that. Your call but, as you stated i dont want that problem again. I tried to radio you a couple of times on the way in but no responce.

[deadbeatloser]

like to know where they get $140 ph and $770 total from? Having a lend of you (and everyone) I feel. Do they charge for wages for the crew also?

If you have insurance, you will probably find that your policy covers you for the fee anyway.

Jeremy

dont think you'd feel the same way if it was you in thier shoes, wat do you think they get all there equipment given to them ,they wish. if your to tight to donate 58 dollars a year maybe people with that attitude to a organisation purely there for our safety should probably stay land based>:(. my last tow which was 42nm and cost 1350. 9yrs ago and thats why i choose to be an mba8-)

[rocksberg6]

like to know where they get $140 ph and $770 total from? Having a lend of you (and everyone) I feel. Do they charge for wages for the crew also?

If you have insurance, you will probably find that your policy covers you for the fee anyway.

Jeremy


Jeremy; What a ridiculous statement. I bet if you ever needed assistance they would be the first people you would call. IMO I would be willing to pay whatever the fee was to have my boat and crew safe and well back on dry land. Are you aware that the V in VMR stands for VOLUNTEER. Just my thoughts on you statement.

[Brooksy]

Jeremy honestly I can't understand why you think that is expensive? They aren't towing these boats home with a 12 foot tinny and 15 hp 4stroke!
They are running a 36 foot? boat and towing another conservatively that boat would be using at least 100l/hr and at that price they aren't even covering fuel costs, let alone wear and tear on equipment, engines oils etc!
At double that cost it would still be good value.

Steve

[joeT]

I thought $140/hr was cheap, it would cost much more to charter a boat of that size per hour privately, especially to tow and even more so because its on call.

[indy]

JEREMY

Mate i don't think that there price is to bad as i made the call to them on sunday at around 6.00 pm which if it was me that's double time rates straight up the people on board the coast gurard had all gone home for the night probably settling down for a sunday roast and next thing they get the call and there all up and out the door for me.

There was eight crew on board there vessel which would have to of been like BROOKSY suggest around the 36 foot mark. Probably didn't need eight to do the job but it was reassuring for me anyway, and a boat that size towing me back would have to of chewed a fair bit of juice.

I am glad to pay the money although it will hurt the back pocket i was just glad to be back on dry land. Also with that cost $770 they have given me a year's membership with that. To tell you the truth i didn't even no about membership with the coastguard but now i do i will be a member for as long as i am boating.

Cheers pete...

[indy]

SPIRO

I heard you calling an responded but for some reason it wasn't getting through had a bit of trouble on 73 don't no why coast guard was picking me up good though.

[Liberty]

$770, $77,000, what price do you put on life?
I don't think any type of synicism or judgemental comments are needed, the Coastguard and VMR are an excellent and very selfless service, I don't think comments like these are warrented

Let's see.

Your boat has gone under.

You're in the water.

A long, long way from home.

You're no longer at the top of the food chain.

And he wants to haggle the price?

ROF'L!!!

My thanks go to the (Volunteer) Air Sea Rescue every time I radio in after coming home.

[indy]

G'day

Got the

[indy]

G'day

Got

[coastrunner]

Hi Pete,
Good to her you made it back ok..
Have a happy new year...

[indy]

Got the starter motor back today only costing $120 dollars for it to be reconditioned bolted it back on and away it went, music to my ears.

I spoke to the auto electrician about it and asked if he would have been able to get it going if he was in the boat and his reply was yes. He explained that you have to hit it with a hammer where the bushes sit which i think is about the only place that chris and i didn't hit.

I have attached a picture of my starter motor and ill try to explain to the people who don't no this incase this ever happens to you, (you might be able to get yourself out of a tow).

One the right hand side of the starter motor the bulkiest part, right down the bottom of it is a silver stainless steel ring that raps around the black part of it holding the bottom of it in place, this is the area you have to hit. This is where your brushes are and this is what usually goes in them.

Dont hit two much above this area as there are a magnets that if they get cracked the starter motor becomes useless.

Hope this helps out if anyone gets into the same predicament

[1337]

Mate how hard do you have to whack that stainless steel ring ... ?

[TonyM]

A few solid taps with the handle of a screwdriver did the job for me when I had the same problem on a Merc outboard about 5 years ago. Luckily I had a mate in the boat with me who is a brilliant backyard mechanic as I would never have known.

Sorry to hear you had such a bummer of a trip Peter, although thankfully you got back ok and it's a great reminder for all of us to support the VMR

[disorderly]

I guess it has to be said that if it were an E-Tec on the back it would have been a simple matter to crank it over with the factory supplied pull starter cord.
Would have saved $770 and you could have kept on fishing.

[Jeremy]

thanks for the numnuts replies and also the sensible replies. I have been a coastguard assocaite member for 7 years now and have no problem paying that. I just thought that $140 per hour was alot to ask to cover actual EXPENSES (ie costs), but I don't run a 36' boat which is why I asked.

Actually I don't think any lives were in danger on this occasion. Indy was with two other boats, so the tow was really only about bringing the vessel back to port (which is still important).

Jeremy

[Spaniard_King]

I guess it has to be said that if it were an E-Tec on the back it would have been a simple matter to crank it over with the factory supplied pull starter cord.
Would have saved $770 and you could have kept on fishing.
Big "D" how about taking a video of you givin us an example of how easy this is:o

[indy]

1337

How can i say hit it firm but not to hard as to break the casing, the bushes are on springs and i think you just need them two move out a little bit.

[4x4frog]

Hope I didn't start a tirade of abuse with my initial comment Jeremy. I just thought it a little odd that someone would post popinting out they didn't think the cost was genuine.;D

[ped cairns]

indy
i have same motor and are wondering how many hours you have done and if you have had any other things go wrong
at 120bucks i may get my own done
thanks ped

[indy]

PED

My last service was at 400 hours so roughly about 450 hours it would have done by now, I have had no other problems with the motor at all it has been nothing but a pleasure.

cheers pete...

[disorderly]

Big "D" how about taking a video of you givin us an example of how easy this is:o

Just cant help yourself can you Gaz!http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/../yabbfiles/Templates/Forum/default/tongue.gif

This isn't a E-Tec vs the rest thread but if you actually think about it , it doesnt take a genius to realise that in a situation like this, being able to start the motor with a rope would have made life so much easier for indy,the VMR ...and his wallet.
Such a simple little thing ,a notch in the flywheel,can mean the difference between a motor that runs and one that doesnt.

and it is a piece of p!ss to pull start it (at least on my 90).http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/../yabbfiles/Templates/Forum/default/smiley.gif

Scott

[Te Whiti]

Thanks for the post Pete,

I post very little on this forum however I probably read every offshore report amongst many in the estuary section. Your post prompted me to call up and become a paying member of Bribie VMR yesterday and glad that I did, even if it is just for the part of paying money to a great Volunteer agency.

Glad to hear you made it back to terra firma.

Mark

[ped cairns]

i have pull started my 20year old merc 150hp but it did have notch
i bumped ski/safety button that you connect to wrist like jet ski to off and flattened battery trying to start before we noticed it was off
battery did not have enough to turn motor from start so i pulled rope and mate hit key to start starter motor a second later, worked beautifully without drain from battery trying to turn from nothing wound over like normal.

[Liberty]

Thanks for the post Pete,

I post very little on this forum however I probably read every offshore report amongst many in the estuary section. Your post prompted me to call up and become a paying member of Bribie VMR yesterday ...

They must have been busy yesterday!

I have had a renewal notice from VMR Raby Bay sitting on my desk for a couple of months but wanted to change to Bribie.

This thread caused me to get off my arse yesterday and sign up.


... and glad that I did, even if it is just for the part of paying money to a great Volunteer agency.



Couldn't agree more.

Nigel

[Peter4]

Great thread guys.

Prompted me to:

1. Join Raby Bay VMR - application & cheque sent today
2. Examine the motor to find out where the starter motor sits (I'm not at all mechanically minded!)
3. Test start the motor using the factory supplied pull cord.

Now all is well. I feel happier and safer as a result of this valuable thread.

Many thanks to all contributors

Pete

[Dirtysanchez]

I don't know how you would go pull starting some of these large motors, I may be wrong but surely the compression would mean you would have to be built like a gorilla to pull start it without either breaking your arm, or the cord ?

[hungry6]

Indy, I heard about your drama the other night and I donot evny you one bit. Nothing s more gut wrenching than when you turn the key and nothing happen..
Well, look on the bright side, it wont happen until you're about 800hrs.
and no doubt your motor would have a good once over before the next trip...

[Salty2]

My motor quit 1 km off Pt.Cartwright on the best/flatest fishing day all year. Got to hate that. The deckie had been promised this trip for two years. Just a broken wire on the ignition circuit box. Here are a couple of photos of the tow in at 23 knots. I thought it would take a while but at this speed we were back in 5 mins.

[disorderly]

I don't know how you would go pull starting some of these large motors, I may be wrong but surely the compression would mean you would have to be built like a gorilla to pull start it without either breaking your arm, or the cord ?

What is it about blokes these days?.
Some are just so afraid to actually do any work!!
I recently noticed that bags of cement have been reduced from 40kg to 20 kg.
Does this mean we are only half as strong these days?
We are fast becoming a nation of pussies.http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/../yabbfiles/Templates/Forum/default/cry.gif

Scott

[Liberty]

What is it about blokes these days?.
Some are just so afraid to actually do any work!!
I recently noticed that bags of cement have been reduced from 40kg to 20 kg.
Does this mean we are only half as strong these days?
We are fast becoming a nation of pussies.http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/../yabbfiles/Templates/Forum/default/cry.gif

Scott

If you want to have a go pull-starting a 250 Yammie, feel free to try one of mine ...

:)

[disorderly]

If you want to have a go pull-starting a 250 Yammie, feel free to try one of mine ...

:)Have you actually tried it?.....

[disorderly]

I'll send you a box of nutrigrain if it will helphttp://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/../yabbfiles/Templates/Forum/default/undecided.gifhttp://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/../yabbfiles/Templates/Forum/default/grin.gif

Scott

PS. If your battery or starter motor fails 40 miles out to sea and you need to start your motor with a rope I think you will find the strength to do it.(as long as there is a notch in the flywheel)

Scott

[Grand_Marlin]

I guess it has to be said that if it were an E-Tec on the back it would have been a simple matter to crank it over with the factory supplied pull starter cord.


Just think, if you had a Cat with twin E-Tecs, you could have pulled yourself silly ;D


Sorry to hear about your day Pete, but at least it ended ok, with everyone returning home safe and well.

I was suprised to hear the comments that people "did not know" about VMR membership... I know a lot of people dont care / couldn't be bothered - so it is a good thing that this story helps create awareness.

I am a member of VMR Brisbane at Sandgate - Ph 3269 8888, or Club President David Davis 3269 7937.
They are a great bunch of blokes, always willing to help you out and to share their knowledge.
They also run a lot of training courses on boating and navigation, organised fishing / cruising / sailing / diving trips, and you can be an active member and help out on the rescues.

Imagine the experience a lot of people would get by going out with an experienced crew to help rescue a boat in rough weather .... priceless.

Cheers

Pete

[indy]

[quote=Grand_Marlin;743759]Just think, if you had a Cat with twin E-Tecs, you could have pulled yourself silly ;D



Lmao pete very funny

cheers pete

[Liberty]

Have you actually tried it?.....

Um no, can't say I have.

[Liberty]

I'll send you a box of nutrigrain if it will helphttp://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/../yabbfiles/Templates/Forum/default/undecided.gifhttp://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/../yabbfiles/Templates/Forum/default/grin.gif

Scott

PS. If your battery or starter motor fails 40 miles out to sea and you need to start your motor with a rope I think you will find the strength to do it.(as long as there is a notch in the flywheel)

Scott

Or .... you turn the switch on the *other* 250 sitting alongside it and drive home.

;D

[FNQCairns]

I am a little amazed that some?? 4 strokes don't include the feature for an emergency start, the amount of times this feature has saved inconvenience and possibly even lives a person couldn't count over the last odd 60 years world wide.

Wonder how hard say a 2.2L 4 stroke is to pullstart, some big motorbikes can be kickstarted, when I buy a 4st one of my main safety criteria could be the inclusion of a de-comp lever?? I simply don't go offshore without a cord designed for this purpose, it's not as if engines have become more reliable per 500h of operation over those of 20y ago apart from in speak marketing anyway.

cheers fnq

[Spaniard_King]

FNQ and others..

Most large 4 strokes.. say 75 and up have there flywheels beneath the crank when you look at the engine in it's running position.

Sort of makes a pullstart a bit hard eh!

Only cam sprockets, alternator pulleys, chains and belts on the top.

I think your a bit cynical thinking about 4 strokes failing. There are always going to be failures that cannot be helped. Unfortunately we only hear of the issues when they come up, I bet there are a very high percentage getting around which have never had problems.

[f.t.r.]

great thread guys

i have a question that i hope someone here may be able to answer.

i, like probably many of you fish out of a few different locations ( live in wynnum, and occasionaly fish gold and sunshine coasts).

i have rung a few coast gaurds/ vmrs regarding membership and cant get the same answer regarding membership at one and required assistance from another.

i have no problem joining a few times, however it hasnt been mentioned so far on this thread, so if anyone is a multiple member, or this isnt required, your help would be appreciated.

for the record i got g.c.seaway membership when i purchased my boat, and was informed by them other memberships were not required.

thanks for your help,
matty

[ballstein]

well that sounds like fun sorry to hear about the bad trip.

peace

[Te Whiti]

f.t.r

I know that the Bribie VMR and Redcliffe Coastguard have reciprocal agreements re: members. ie, when the Bribie VMR closes at 6pm, they pass their books onto Redcliffe Coastguard (closes at 9pm weekdays i think) to monitor anyone who is still offshore and hasnt yet come back in. if you required assistance after 6pm and was a member at Bribie, Redcliffe would come out and assist you.

That being said, there may well be more reciprocal agreements like this between other VMR and Coastguard agencies.

Hope this in some way helps

Mark

[Petere]

Good to hear you are well and safe, as for the comment of what VMR or the Coast Guard charge, mate my old man is a memeber of the Coast Guard at Manly and they have had to risk their lives to rescue blokes like you that think they are 6 foot tall and bullet proof.
The sea is not a place to gamble as she is a harsh mistress and when blokes from VMR and the Coast Guard put to sea in atrocious or mirror like conditions they put their lives at risk to rescue you.
You couldn't and shouldn't question the dollars they charge, but if you do you life surely must be worth more than the 100- 200 dollars an hour they charge.

Stupidity is free
Life is not, there is always some cost associated.

[indy]

PETERE

To rescue blokes like you that think they are 6 foot tall and bullet proof.

Do you no me do you, actually you dont no me from a bar of soap.

You couldn't and shouldn't question the dollars they charge

I was just wanting to no when did i actually question the dollars they charge, at no stage in the thread did i, and all i have actually done have made others aware that by becoming a member of the coast guard that if they where unfortunate enough to break down that by becoming a member they would recieve a free tow back to shore. In turn the coast guard would recieve many more members helping out there costings throughout the year by me putting this thread up.

The more i read of your post the more i think i am wasting my time replying to such dribbell. Its all so a real pity we share the same name.

[hungry6]

Dont you go by the name "pepe" LOL
I think Petere is just venting some frustration and not reading all the original post or the bulk of it...
Dont worry Indy, we still love you, and no doubt the VMR will tow you back if you ever happen to break down again.
and for the record, Alot of guys do know their soap bar intimately...
Ppls who joins the VMR and coast guards and all the others volunteer group do it to help the general communities and self satisfaction and being a valuable assets to the communities, the majorities of these ppls rarely speak out or asks anything in returns for their selfless acts, and they would not speak to any member of the public in the way "PETERE" would as it would be beneath them to do so...

[Burley_Boy]

Spoke to VMR jacobs well the other day.
They charge zero to members inshore and an hourly fee offshore.
I said I could not even consider not paying the petrol costs if i got an inshore tow and they said 99% of people don't pay nor donate.
Blew me away.

[lenm5]

Thanks for sharing your ordeal Indy - It's a pitty you've copped some flac in the process.
I guess twin motors is the only way to have avoided this situation - although I even remember seeing a twin motor zodiac being towed in one day which had badly deflated.
LM

[mik01]

Spoke to VMR jacobs well the other day.
They charge zero to members inshore and an hourly fee offshore.
I said I could not even consider not paying the petrol costs if i got an inshore tow and they said 99% of people don't pay nor donate.
Blew me away.

just like the westpac chopper, ses etc... everyone wants someone to look out for them but no one wants to pay when they need it. good on you, Indy, for opening up your wallet and acknowledging the service you received!

its just crazy really - if you can't afford $500+ to be rescued, then you should fork out $60 and join for a year.

its the cheapest life insurance you can buy.

cheers,
Mick

[disorderly]

I guess twin motors is the only way to have avoided this situation
LM


You obviously didn't read the thread ,lenm5.
A very simple solution for problems of this nature is to have an outboard which is able to be pull-started.

Scott