Gulps & Powerbaits : A Con-job or are they for real ?

[rogersto]

Four weeks ago, I decided to give SP's a try, after reading the many comments in the Gulps vs Squidgies thread. Seems the general consensus that Gulps should (theoretically) attract more fish.

So out I went, bought a couple of DVD's (BCF's Snapper/Bream/Flathead disc has some footage shot here on the broadwater with this guy hooking up flathead using gulps and powerbaits), and Berkley have an excellent DVD on their SP's with this guy gettin stuck into Bream, Flathead and Jew in various saltwater clips.

Off to BCF I went and "invested" some of my hard-earned cash in all the right gear that I'm supposed to use on my rod. Fireline, vanish leader and an assortment of Jigheads from Wilson, Nitro and Gamagatsu, plus a pile of gulps and powerbaits in all shapes and sizes, from white shaky shads in 3", mullet, grubs and such, white, pink, brown (pumpkin seed), all-in-all $150 worth of goodies.

Despite doing everything instructed in the DVD's I have yet to hook and land a single fish on these little plastic wonders.

Starting a month ago, the first two weeks were 100% fishless for the first time in my life (I'm 42 and have been fishing since I was a teenager). Not even an undersize Bream or whiting on a 2" shrimp on a little jighead with a size 4 hook.

2 weeks ago I started to go and pump yabbies again and take 2 rods out with me, either a 7ftr for the estuaries, or a 9ftr for the tally river breakwall, and my usual 12ft'er with sinker and size 4 hook for a cast with a yabby.

When the water's relatively clear you can see the fish move around down there, and casting any of the gulps in there doesn't seem to do much except for the Bream and Dart chewing the friggin tails off, casting into the beach side.

Yesterday, an entire pack of gulps demolished within the hour casting into the surf, Bream and Dart absolutely love them tails. It would eventually be completely gone. Whether it's these, or a white shaky shad on a bigger hook/sinker jighead, makes no difference, they just love chewing off those friggin tails instead of hitting in from the side and getting hooked up.

http://www.wellnessnrg.com/__webpics/gulp1.jpg


There's some decent sized fish in there, as I found out when I grabbed the other rod, put a yabby on the hook, and cast it into the same area, hooking up into the odd good-sized dart and plenty of toss-me-back undersized bream.

No such luck with them gulps. All the fish do is chew into the tails, eventually rendering them useless and destined to be replaced. Suppose that's how the company makes its money.

http://www.wellnessnrg.com/__webpics/gulp2.jpg

Away from the surf in the estuaries, the plastics are even more useless because toadfish absolutely LOVE THEM !!!

An early morning session off budds beach last week saw 1 pack of 2" shrimps in gulp nuclear chicken gone, 2-3 casts, chop chop and the rear end chewed, and half a pack of these little fellas (picture above) gone. 2-3 casts into the early morning darkness sees the tails chopped up and eventually gone.

Toadfish.

Tallebudgera River up near Yabby island reveals that little whiting also chase after them chomping into the rear ends of the plastics. As the plastic becomes visible in the shallows on the retrieve, I can see whiting, toadfish and some other fish with a zebra patten nibble into the plastic's rear end. Bigger fish seem to ignore them, and they're in there because when I cast off the footbridge I can see bigger fish swimming around the gulp with the littlies mucking around with it and chomping on the tail. Repeat same exercise with a yabby, yep the little fish usually beat the bigger fish to it, stealing the bait, but the bigger fish try a little bit harder though.

Cast after cast next to one of the bridge pylons produced nothing on the M1 overpass, nor down below the Gold Coast Hwy bridge at Currumbin Creek. Repeat same exercise with Yabbies, and nibbles galore, lots of lost yabbies, but landing the occasional fish here and there. Lots of undersized bream around, but it proves without any reasonably doubt that Gulps are over-hyped and DO NOT outfish all other bait, that statement on the packet is misleading and should be against the law.

"Fish Eat it" might be more true, but should make a reference to the tail or rear end of the plastic, as my personal experiences see a relatively small number of chomps into the actual body of the gulp, compared to tail hits.

Toss a yabby on a #4 hook in there and it won't take me long to hook up something, usually a small whiting, toadie or a lucky flathead (took yabbies to Budds Beach last week and used the 7ft rod with the plastics, and the 9ft with the size 4 hook for the yabbies.

Spent a total of 2 hours casting gulps and scoring nothing but wasting a pack and a half of the rip-off mongrels, and about half an hours' worth of casting into the same areas landed me a 32cm flathead (dinner), 3 undersized bream, a whiting and one of those friggin toadfish that seem to be everywhere, that went back to live another day.

What gives?

Doing everything the guys are doing on those 2 DVD's in terms of how to put'em on the jig, slow retrieves with little jerks and all that, but no fish?

[marty+jojo]

Mate i know where you are coming from, when i started out using plastics over five years ago i had similar experiences. All i can say is keep trying and experiment try a slighghtly faster retrieve or slower one. Sometimes if the water is very clear they can be difficult to catch on sp's. Try an area with a bit more tidal run therefore the fish are more likely to hit your plastic before it is washed away. I now never take bait with me, just sp's and i do allright. If tou do decide that sp's are a con let me know i will take all those rip off plastics off your hands ;D ;D ;D
Good luck let us know how you go.
Marty.

[rogersto]

Been doing lots of experimenting, doing different things, but keep on getting the same results. No fish on SP's, only chomped off tails. Haven't landed a single thing on them.

tried slow retrieves, fast retrieces, fished in clear water, not-so-clear water, and the murky depths of the Tallebudgera River and upper reaches of the Nerang River (landbased near Carrara, where flatties are supposed to be found).

Fished at the bottom of the tide, from before to after the top of the tide, off the seaway, off the tally river breakwall, slow moving water, fast moving water.

Zilch, zip, nothing. Repeat exercise with the other rod, loaded with a live yabbie, and it gets hit pretty quickly.

Crikeys, yesterday morning the guys with the pillies were hooking up more fish than me and my rip-off gulps, but the moment I switch across to yabbies, I get nibbles, and hook up dart, small bream, and the occasional keeper.

I'm not one to give up easily - but I have never seen such a futile exercise.

My first 2 weeks using the placcies I thought the fish weren't biting, and since the only company I had down there were a couple of guys chasing tailor on whole pillies, and weren't scoring all that well, I thought there wasn't much doing.

But the moment I brought live yabbies and a second rod into the picture, a completely new scenario begun to unfold. The fish are in there, little fellas and a few pan sized ones also. It's simply a case of I present them with some kind of bait, and they either go for it or don't.

One thing's for sure, yabbies and pilchards attract a hell lot more fish to them than gulps do any day.

One thing I agree on, a gulp is infinitly more durable at the end of the line than a yabbie any day. Or a pilchard or mullet for that matter...

But I beg to differ when it comes to attracting fish. Tails chewed off time and time again and the expense of the buggers is a real downside, but I'm keen-as to catch fish on the buggers rather than continually lucking out.

Yabbies are great, but I got to go drive over there, pump them, usually keep them alive overnight for the next morning's fishing.

The whole reason I got into the plastics is the concept of having an assortment in the fridge, and being able to just grab'em in their beaut little blue carry bag, which also contains a small tackle case of jigs and stuff, slip on down to the garage and grab the rod, bucket and knife and head to my favourite spot, travelling light. No tackle box, just placcies, rod, bucket and a knife....

[ashh]

I find Sqidgys last alot longer than gulps. Sure they arent 'edible', and have scent like the gulps, but if they dont have the scent, they arent gonna attract the likes of toadfish as they are mostly scavengers, where as a bream will have a go and attack the placcy, usually on the initial drop and more than likely before it even smells a scent. But if fishing was slow, the scent would definately help, maybe, depends what your targeting I suppose

[webby]

Mate there like being addicted to Coccaine and hurt your pocket just as much, and after sometime you need a monthly trip to a Physco to help stem the addiction.
but then i'm not one thats addicted hehehehe
regards

[juju]

Just came back form BCF, bought a packet of chickens to try when i go out this week, last time i fished the plastics while the old man used bait...i caught a few fish but nothing to get excited about....and he didnt do much different except for one train that hit and went straight back under the boat bast the leg of the outboard.....i had the same thing with the tails getting knocked off.....ill give it a few more trys...one good fish would convert me i guess.....i dont know but ..i like sitting there holding the rod feeling the bite...waiting.....not too much into the anount of casting and working of the plastics......if i were catching fish id guess it would be different but when you cast bring in...cast bring in...cast bring in... it gets a bit old....

[HH17L]

Mate, I know where your coming from. I have also just starting out using plastics, yesterday i gave them another try out at Mud Island, couple of little nibbles & once the tails had gone the fish didnt seem interested. I suppose it's just a case of perserverence till you figure out the best method to suit your style of fishing. I know i have the right gear, it's probably the action i havn't got right yet, also there wasn't much run out their yesterday. Might be a good idea to get a few of us "Plastic Newby's" together with someone who is well versed in the art to give us a few more idea's. I know for one i am more than willing to learn if it produces the goods. I would be willing to offer my place if other people would be keen to sit down & have a chat.;D

Andrew.

[juju]

I was wondering if there is a use for the ones with the tails bitten off?....

[PinHead]

Con Job...I did a bit of a test this morning at the marina...tossed some bread in the water and the bream went ballistic over it...I then tossed a plastic in amongst it all...not one fish showed any interest in the plastic...not even the ducks wanted it.

[kingtin]

Con Job...I did a bit of a test this morning at the marina...tossed some bread in the water and the bream went ballistic over it...I then tossed a plastic in amongst it all...not one fish showed any interest in the plastic...not even the ducks wanted it.

Bloody hell Greg! You've come up with a winner! Quick! Let's find a way to manufacture a placcy that looks like a slice of bread, before Gulp come up with the idea. ;D

kev

[PinHead]

first thing you have to do kev is to come up with some ridiculous name...like the nuked chook or whatever they call it....how about a 3" Crusty?..or a 2" Toastie?

or just a plain simple old 2" crumb.

[swano]

we all started something like yourself i,m sure but the more you try different things like reducing the size of your leader (ie; thinner in clear water) , changing size and or brand of jig head to suit each plastic (ie; heavier jig for paddel tails or fast current, lighter for jerk baits or split tails and still water) and try attaching the jig with a perfection loop as it gives extra action and freedom to the plastic (its in most knot books) and probably the best thing you can do is cast into your pool (or ya mates) and try different retieves for each plakky as this is how you will understand the best action achievable for each one .
best of luck.. cheers swano

[rogersto]

believe it or not, that's one thing I actually did, swano. got some funny looks from the missus and the kids trying different retrieves and watching how it moves around.

Learnt the perfection loop trick from one of the DVD's and indeed it gives it more freedom of movement.

juju, I first thought run them through some kind of mincer and use them for burley. But then again, they don't attract fish like bread and pieces of fish.

HH17L, I'd be keen-as to be part of that. Wouldn't need to be done at anybody's place but out in the field on some rockwall or somethere where there's some fish.

I mean if I can see somebody real (not on a DVD) actually catching something on these things, preferably keepers not undersized throw-me-backs then there's something there.

I'm hooked on the concept of being able to go out there travelling light, bag of gulps, rod and a bucket, no tackle box, just grab'n'go, but I want to be able to catch fish....

re: Squidgies (ashh) what if you put that spray-on scent on them, the stuff they sell at BCF? Would that make a difference? The best of both worlds, a durable SP - spray on the scent on the body of the plastic not the tail. Reckon the toadies won't nip at the tail, then again, it's not just toadies that have a love affair with gulp and powerbait tails, bream and whiting also chomp into them from the assend...

[imnotoriginal]

I know it's frustrating mate, I went through the exact same phase, where I didn't trust them for so long, but it will only take that one fish and you'll be hooked. I'll make one suggestion if I may, if there's a lot of toadfish round, sometimes it's just not worth the effort. They are mean devils and the plastic fisherman's worst nightmare, so best to try another spot if they're thick. Another suggestion for me would be keep targetting the flathead with plastics, there's a reason most plastics fisherman catch flathead first and by targetting them from the start you're more likely to get some success which will keep your faith in them. Good luck mate, I'm sure you'll get that on fish soon, just persevere.
Joel

[ashh]

mate you could very well dip them in whatever scent you like or feel works best.
When I fish for bass with my brother in the dams, we have a bottle of the good ol garlic scent and just dip the placcys tail in it.

[gone_fishing]

i have more success with plastic than with bait
catching bream around the mangroves and flatheads in the faster moveing water
when i stat getting the tails bit off its usally little toadfish ( dropped one in about 3" of water one day and the little buggers came from nowhere and destroyed it before i could pick it up ) i either move on a bit or try somthing else
never had a bream bite the tail off but they have ripped the middle out though
better to be lucky than good id reakon
ill keep trying them they are hard work and make you think of how and were your fishing lots of trial and error

[BilgeBoy]

You poor bloke...I sure know your pain.

It goes against every bone in your body to persist with this ridiculous plastic affliction. I sure agree with Webby that SP's are cocaine for fisherman. In fact I would love to meet the Berkley Exec's. I can just picture this building full of fisherman in little rooms being questioned by psychiatrists.....MUST BUY PLASTICS!

I myself have been at this plastics game for a short while now and am only just starting to get some results. Jig head choice, SP colour, leader etc all play a big part but by far the most effective is the technique. I too have watched a few vid's and thought I had it sussed...but as I am learning there is more to it.

Nowadays I take bait and plastics...and fish the situation!! Odd way of describing it but some days I couldn't buy a bite on placcies and other days...they go off!! Who knows.

One big plus is the ability to keep and emergency fishing kit in the car. Then anywhere anytime I can wet a line and let the world pass me by....

Good luck with it mate.

Regards

BilgeBoy

[alfish]

rogersto
i know exactly how you feel.
I'm on a mission this season to master bream on placcies, i,ve caught a grand total of zilch in 20 hours fishing so far, but i'm a stubborn bastard and won't give up until i've got a decent return on my investment.
My mates are havin an absolute ball at my expense, so i haven't told em how much i've been out recently.
I'm even going down to manly now to have another go.

what a sucker, but thats fishing.

cheers al

[Th0m]

ive been messing with them aswell, first time i used it i landed a nice flat head and took home and ate and was generally impressed. but then after bout 2 weeks of buying the things. watching the little leather jackets pull the tails off and leave em i become a little sceptical of them. do they attract fish? no question they do attract more i think than the average bait. not so sure.
tommorrow im planning on heading round a mates n seeing how they go but as for fishing on them all day, nah to pricey. im just gonna grab some other common baits and see how they go.
also with the sofites seems that for me i only do land keepers. i know everyones a little different but i really dont mind realing in a few small ones or undersize fish and chucking them back rather than just waiting there and getting nothing all day

[Jeremy]

all you whingers and sooks....if you don't like it, don't do it. No one is forcing you. SPs work for those people who persist and enjoy the hunt and the thrill of fooling a fish into taking an artificial bait. If you don't have the patience, or soaking a bait is more your thing, just stick to that. If you choose not to believe all the reports of fish taken on SPs, knock urself out.

SP and lure fishing in general is an active form of fishing which requires some skill in the choice of lure and the presentation. It doesn't work all the time, but then neither does bait.

(and yes, I have caught bream, flathead, trevally, snapper on SPs)

Jeremy

[bushbeachboy]

Hey Rogersto,
The jury is still out on SP's for me personally, but I've only put in minimal time and effort yet. There seems to be lots to learn about stuff like leaders, jig head weight in relation to run, sizes of plastics etc etc etc. I think you would have to spend a lot of time and effort to become consistently successful with them, and remember it also depends on the fish. If they aren't interested at the time you are fishing, you won't catch them. Personally I'm starting out gradually, taking the SP's on every trip, but mainly fishing with bait. The SP's open up other options for me, they are cheaper than hard body lures, can be fished weightless, or lightly weighted, or heavily weighted, light leader, or heavy leader, or tied straight to mono, or straight to braid, slow retrieve, fast retrieve, almost no retrieve, swum in the current, more rod movement, less rod movement etc etc etc. It's all fun, and better than work. Hehe.
Cheers mate and good luck!

[yellahunter]

Tallebudgera River up near Yabby island reveals that little whiting also chase after them chomping into the rear ends of the plastics. As the plastic becomes visible in the shallows on the retrieve, I can see whiting, toadfish and some other fish with a zebra patten nibble into the plastic's rear end. Bigger fish seem to ignore them, and they're in there because when I cast off the footbridge I can see bigger fish swimming around the gulp with the littlies mucking around with it and chomping on the tail. Repeat same exercise with a yabby, yep the little fish usually beat the bigger fish to it, stealing the bait, but the bigger fish try a little bit harder though.

Cast after cast next to one of the bridge pylons produced nothing on the M1 overpass, nor down below the Gold Coast Hwy bridge at Currumbin Creek. Repeat same exercise with Yabbies, and nibbles galore, lots of lost yabbies, but landing the occasional fish here and there. Lots of undersized bream around, but it proves without any reasonably doubt that Gulps are over-hyped and DO NOT outfish all other bait, that statement on the packet is misleading and should be against the law.

What gives?

Doing everything the guys are doing on those 2 DVD's in terms of how to put'em on the jig, slow retrieves with little jerks and all that, but no fish?


Hey Rogersto,
Mate it all takes getting used too etc as its a very different style of fishing to the old yabbie on a hook thing. Ive been fishing with plastics for over a year now and rarely use anything else. Im landbased most of the time and enjoy reasonable success using them.

I have found that the Gulp shrimps are the best plastic for currumbin creek and seem to catch plenty of fish. It might be that your fising areas that are too crowded with small bream/toadfish, thus the plastics are getting destroyed. on average a pack of gulp shrimp would last me 2 weeks fishing everynight for an hour or two in currumbin. Ive found that the only time i lose a lure its when its snagged or ruined from catching 1/2 a dozen fish.

I will tell you right now that fishing with gulps/plastics is not as productive as throwing a live yabbie in however its more enjoyable if you like to constantly move etc. I would say that the quality of fish is better too, on a yabbie your likely to encounter bream/toadies/whiting all under 20cm however on a gulp you are more of a chance to tangle with bream (20cm+, trevally, flathead, mangrove jacks, pike etc)

mate if your keen to fish currumbin one night pm me and we can go down for an hour or so and i will show you what ive learned.

cheers,

Ben

[rogersto]

that's definetly an offer I will be taking up.

All I want to see is some results and introduce some variety into my fishing. It's mostly yabbies all the way, and yep, I always land heaps of smaller fish which end up going back to live another day, but I also bring in keepers and interestingly some luderick or a jew for variety, but depending on the time of year, it's mostly Dart, Bream, Whiting and the occasional Flathead and on very rare occasions the odd jewie to spice things up....

I'm keen to notch up more flathead which has been one driving reason towards the placcies.

[Chris Ryan]

I have been trying Squidies for over a year now and not a fish in the boat or on the shore. I have had some hit and shredded but not a hook-up. So after much soul searching and self confincing I bought some berkley Gulp! baits in various sizes and colours and through them around the back of Peel Island on Sunday morning (with the carpark of others chasing that bait school). I did get two undersize flatties to the boat but they spat the hooks before I got them in - but I saw them and the Mrs saw them so they count!!!! Ha ha ha. I had larger sizes as I wanted yo see if I could get into some of the bigger fish around. I changed to a 4" shad in pumpkin seed and the tails were desctroyed everycast......I blame the grinners in the bay for that.

I will persist with the squidies and might try the scent spray, but after mucking around for ages I can say I caught two fish on placcies now. Just need to land some bigguns and frequently. Just as a comparison the only biggun we got on bait all day was a 40cm sweetlip around the back of Mud Island. Everything else was either rays, shovelies or F***ING Grinners.... :)

However I would still be keen to see/watch/learn from someone more attune to the art of placcie fishing to see what/if there is something I am missing. If Starlo and Bushy can do it..........................

Puff

[Roo]

I've played with these things for nearly 15years and am nowhere near an expert but i believe therefore i catch......mostly. you need faith in your lure for it to work well. I've pinned flathead for years on simple Mr twisters and lately I've finally managed to get the occasional bream on the placcies too. I couldn't figure out why the bream wouldn't take mine until l slowed everything right down.

keep at it.

cheers roo.

[Nowhere Bob]

I'll sing along with the choir.
I bought my first plactics as an inexpensive alternative to the snag gods appetite for my HB lures. I too went through a period of thinking they were a pointless marketing device, then I thought they only catch really dumb and desparate fish, Now I think they are an interesting & productive way to go for a fish.

I think when I first started with HB's I went through a similar process.

As with most lurers I like the active 'hunt' of lure fishing more than the stationary bait approach. That said, these days I will usually take lure & bait and will try the lures first. If no luck, then I'll switch to bait.

Hope this helps, all I can sugest is persist.
(And I bags all those fish you miss. They are mine, all mine! wahhahaha)

[marty+jojo]

Rogersto,
Do a search on my name or Foggy, T1,Tinn,Poodroo,Scalem etc have a look all these guys, they and plenty more use plastics with success. If you still are not convinced give up and go back to being a bait fisho.... i will happily take all ya plastics.
Marty.

[PinHead]

I think they may have created plastics for those that are a bit "soft"..they don't like the smell of bait...lol

[Scalem]

Rogersto,
Do a search on my name or Foggy, T1,Tinn,Poodroo,Scalem etc have a look all these guys, they and plenty more use plastics with success. If you still are not convinced give up and go back to being a bait fisho.... i will happily take all ya plastics.
Marty.

Thanks Marty for the mention - there's now a list of AF members successfully using SP's- too many to mention. I learned a valuable lesson on the weekend where I would have definitely been better off fishing bait. NEVER take an inexperienced family along to fish places like Wello. I epitomised the word frustration, and if anything practised my knot tying skills like never before. I should have taken the family down the pin and pumped yabbies, but added some of that fluro glow stuff on their backs just to help my addiction;D

But it's not holdens or fords, cowboys or broncos.. If you feel that your tails are getting knocked off, don't write it off and say the toadies love these gulps, you might be surprised to find it's a school of chopper tailor and are better putting on a ganged hook. You can certainly mix both styles. But this is where failure often sets in, and understanding what environments and species respond the best on bait or S/P's. If you have fished plastics for a few occasions and got nothing, how many fish SP's for a few minutes, then anchor up ( 1st sign of failure with SP's IMO) and start fishing bait, then forever resolved to saying they are a rip off? Some will unreservedly jump in and tell everyone what they think of the plastics, but I know a couple of them have larger boats that make drifting difficult, and may not have tried plastics in a smaller boat capable moving around stealthily. Let me take some of your larger vessels out to cape Moreton to fish for pearlies and Snapper, that's the environment you should be very successful using placcies.

I know T, Aquarius, Adamy have all had newbies in their boats with great results!

Here's some stats.
Using "For Steve" as an example - if that's OK Brad. He had caught one or two fish around Peel and a couple of places I can't remember, using Placcies. I went to Wello in his boat, observing he had all the right gear. Just one small modification to his technique that I suggested.... and a couple of trips later he's having a ball with a PB a few weeks ago of 52cm and we have named a spot X off Green called T.I.G.S which stands for "this is getting stupid" because we were catching an Absurd amount of fish. In Brad's case I hope I had some hand in his recent success, I hope so. Another mate Anthony is in his mid 30's ( fished since he was a kid) and never used SP's. 1st trip out with me and registers his PB Flathead and PB Snapper. I had mixed success in the bay with baits over the years, a 37KG PB Cobia on livie, some LT's, Jack, Spotties, Parrot but never did much good on Snapper... Until I started using Placcies. I have to keep targeting Parrot with the Gulp shrimp because I've caught them on this before.... Twice I put one of those on my wifes' line and both times she got busted up big time!! But I should try bait ( fresh squid or crab ) if Parrot was the target species, and with much heavier line. Another reason I should consider bait more often is that lately I have had more than my usual chances to wet a line, getting out almost every weekend for the last 2 months. The largest amount of plastics I went through in one day was 5 packets, average price $9.00 a pack. With jig heads and leader material, it's fair to say that's $50.00 per trip + fuel. Yep, the yabbie pump has to come out for the next few trips!!

Scalem

[blaze]

thumbs up for Scalem
Great reply for a fisho thats 99% bait
cheers
blaze
ps
will always be a bait fisho but play with them smelly soft plastics sometimes to keep others amused

[Dezzer]

The plastics work! It definitely takes a bit of getting use to but I haven't looked back to the dark side for 2 yrs now. No smelly hands and economical when you consider the price of fresh bait for each trip (unless you collect your own). I've never been through more than 1 packet per trip, 9 is pretty good going scalem!
Having said that I still can't get the bloody things to work in deep water even though they obviously do going by the reports on this site.

[rogersto]

I'm taking up yellahunter's offer of a toss into currumbin creek.

Although I've got some reservations about the bottom of the tide in the evenings, who knows what one can catch. Top of the tide would normally be a better bet, we'll see what happens.....

[charlie bouy]

If at first you dont succeed.........

Keep at it and work out your own technique, maybe slow is down a bit i get nearly all my hhok ups as they drop back down and they way whats down there might havbe a chance to hit the SP rather than just nip the tail..... there not raiders

[charlie bouy]

Ps....

In 6 To 12 Month I Would Like You To Start A Thread Titled

" I Would Like To Apolgise To All Ausfish Sp Fishers And Personally To Berkley And Gulp Powerbait"

You Could Then Proceed To Go On.....

" I Have Now Learnt That Paitence And Persistance Is A Virtue"...and .... "i Reccomend Everyone Try Colour-x At Spot-x Cause I Bagged Out Of Flattie And Bream The Other Day"

[rogersto]

An apology, hardly likely....

As a matter of fact, considering the fact that I had a run-in with QLD Fair Trading with my claim that "we are the coast's #1 ISP by a long shot", they kind of voiced an objection to that claim because apart from some customer testimonials there's no actual evidence backing up that claim.

However, I have in my posession two packs of gulp, the pumkinseed mullet says "Outfishes ALL other bait (even live)!" and the shaky shad gulp simply claim to "Outfish all other bait". No disclaimer, you know when you get hit upon by one of those Amway people proclaiming how you can get stinkin' filthy rich in network marketing - there's this disclaimer that says income figures are for educational purposes only and are not typical and are dependent upon ones efforts.

I certainly haven't found that buying the right stuff, a couple of intructional DVD's and doing that those guys were doing, and landing some fish using those things, what's more going out with 2 rods, and hooking up with yabbies but not with gulps - well they're overstepping the mark with their advertising and hype.

There's obviously some merit to these things, hence I shall persist. Only because there's enough people in these forums claiming varying levels of success. They can't all be paid off or sponsored by berkley, or have some other connection that financially benefit them. Actually I'd be inclined to think very few, if any.

Come to think of it, SP's have a lot in common with Amway, Network marketing and such, all are portrayed to be much easier and simpler to do than they are in reality - the reality being there's a little bit more to it than meets the eye.

A bit like golf, most people will find it extremely difficult to get the basic swing fundamentals right by watching some Butch Harmon or Steve Leadbetter golf tutorial videos, and in reality you need to spend some time with a golf pro to get your swing fundamentals in the right direction so you get the clubface hitting the ball squarely, thus resulting in a straight shot.

Seems to me with the placcies you need the same persistence and better still go out with somebody who's using them with some level of success, hence the live bait yabbie junkie like me who decides to take the plunge hits a dead end, whilst a guy who goes out with his mates every now and then, and has one of them using placcies instead of pillies or yabs learns first hand in real life from his mates what he's doing there, and then takes the plunge investing in some jiggaroonies and an assortment of placcies of all shapes and colours resembling a zoo....

what I will be doing though is you tube videos and tutorials and a thread here to tell anybody who wants to know how I broke the ice and got around the frustration and got results.

[Jeremy]

Rogersto,

your last post indicated that you are starting to get the picture. Some of the things you said are right on the money.

the 'golf pro' bit is a good analogy. Going out with someone who knows what they are doing is the fastest way to learn. If you are really serious, I would recommend a professional guide such as Brad Smith. I did a charter with his when I was first starting to use hard bodied lures and learned heaps from him.

'Amway' is also good. Alot more to it that meets the eye, and persistence and hard work in the beginning goes a long way. You won't make any money out of it though.

But really, if it doesn't work for you, stick to bait and enjoy your fishing whatever way works for you.

Jeremy

[slyman]

I found plastics infinately easier to use from a boat than landbased. When fishing landbased, the fish aren't always going to be where you are fishing, therefore you keep moving around to locate them. On a boat you can cover a lot more water, and have access to those spots that only fish and folks in boats can get to. Also, you end up retrieving your line from the deeper water you've cast to, into the shallower water at your feet, as opposed to casting from a boat in a channel towards the shallower water near the structure where the fish are. Landbased plastics have to be hopped UP the contour to the water line, whereas from a boat you retrieve DOWN the contour, this allows you to slow the retrieve right down and let the current provide some of the action to the dropping plastic. I found that having to bring the plastic UP the contour required too much action making for an unnatural look, whereas letting the current do its thing provides an action that is more subtle and natural.

Also try using different shaped jigheads and larger plastics and larger hooks. Bullet shaped or darter style jigheads will help the plastic travel through the water in a different fashion to the ball/sinker type, making them scoot and dart erratically from side to side in addition to the vertical movement. Bigger plastics will usually attract the bigger fish, however you'll still get smaller fish on them too. I haven't used a plastic smaller than 4inch for ages, unless I'm using the berkley 2inch peeler crab, which I've caught legal tuskfish and squire on. I mainly use berkley jerk shads 5 inch on a 3/0 to 5/0 TT jighead with weights between 1/12 and 1/4 depending on how deep the water and how fast the current is. Mainly its the 1/8 weight.

Going from using a sinker for holding baits, to using a fixed weight tied directly to the end of your line that will 1) provide a bit of weight for casting and 2) get the plastic to the bottom without making it plummet to the bottom or alternatively be too light and not ever reach the bottom, was the hardest part of the plastics equation for me.

Perserverance is the go, keep at it and things will start to fall into place. Eventually the fish will not only be lured, but deceived also. Good luck!!

Simon

[joeT]

I have only had success with plastics from a boat, and only in certain conditions of fishing. Like all methods of fishing, plastics have their place and are really versatile and convenient, but they can't replace all other methods of fishing.

[Scalem]

I found plastics infinately easier to use from a boat than landbased. When fishing landbased, the fish aren't always going to be where you are fishing, therefore you keep moving around to locate them. On a boat you can cover a lot more water, and have access to those spots that only fish and folks in boats can get to. Also, you end up retrieving your line from the deeper water you've cast to, into the shallower water at your feet, as opposed to casting from a boat in a channel towards the shallower water near the structure where the fish are. Landbased plastics have to be hopped UP the contour to the water line, whereas from a boat you retrieve DOWN the contour, this allows you to slow the retrieve right down and let the current provide some of the action to the dropping plastic. I found that having to bring the plastic UP the contour required too much action making for an unnatural look, whereas letting the current do its thing provides an action that is more subtle and natural.

Also try using different shaped jigheads and larger plastics and larger hooks. Bullet shaped or darter style jigheads will help the plastic travel through the water in a different fashion to the ball/sinker type, making them scoot and dart erratically from side to side in addition to the vertical movement. Bigger plastics will usually attract the bigger fish, however you'll still get smaller fish on them too. I haven't used a plastic smaller than 4inch for ages, unless I'm using the berkley 2inch peeler crab, which I've caught legal tuskfish and squire on. I mainly use berkley jerk shads 5 inch on a 3/0 to 5/0 TT jighead with weights between 1/12 and 1/4 depending on how deep the water and how fast the current is. Mainly its the 1/8 weight.

Going from using a sinker for holding baits, to using a fixed weight tied directly to the end of your line that will 1) provide a bit of weight for casting and 2) get the plastic to the bottom without making it plummet to the bottom or alternatively be too light and not ever reach the bottom, was the hardest part of the plastics equation for me.

Perserverance is the go, keep at it and things will start to fall into place. Eventually the fish will not only be lured, but deceived also. Good luck!!

Simon

So Simon, have you tried using a sea anchor? It will help you reach the bottom if only using the 1/8th oz. I can't remember using anything heavier in the bay for a long time.

Scalem

[kingtin]

So Simon, have you tried using a sea anchor? It will help you reach the bottom if only using the 1/8th oz. I can't remember using anything heavier in the bay for a long time.

Scalem

The trouble is, get over near Moreton and fish anything other than slack and even a 1oz won't get you to the bottom, in fact, I tried a 1oz with a 5" nuclear chicken last time out and it floated :o

I'd really like to get into 'em for offshore work as I've invested so much in 'em (the large jig heads are a ridiculous price), but I can't seem to get 'em to the bottom, even on 12lb line. I've tried sticking 'em on a paternoster rig with a heavy weight, just like fishing for reefies but with placcies instead of bait, but I don't get a touch. Try working 5 oz of lead http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/7/7_5_139.gif .............I might as well be jigging as placcying::)

Any tips on using 'em in current would be appreciated.

kev

[Chris Ryan]

Scalem,

Now I am joining your ranks - I guarantee you there will be coffee sessions around James Street looking for the inside running on SP usage!!!

See you next Wednesday for Day 1.

Cheers,
Puff

[Scalem]

Scalem,

Now I am joining your ranks - I guarantee you there will be coffee sessions around James Street looking for the inside running on SP usage!!!

See you next Wednesday for Day 1.

Cheers,
Puff

Congrats Mate, looking forward to it!;) Only.... Do I tell my wife now, I am likely to be a little late for dinner??;D ;D

See you soon!

Scalem

[Scalem]

The trouble is, get over near Moreton and fish anything other than slack and even a 1oz won't get you to the bottom, in fact, I tried a 1oz with a 5" nuclear chicken last time out and it floated :o

I'd really like to get into 'em for offshore work as I've invested so much in 'em (the large jig heads are a ridiculous price), but I can't seem to get 'em to the bottom, even on 12lb line. I've tried sticking 'em on a paternoster rig with a heavy weight, just like fishing for reefies but with placcies instead of bait, but I don't get a touch. Try working 5 oz of lead http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/7/7_5_139.gif .............I might as well be jigging as placcying::)

Any tips on using 'em in current would be appreciated.

kev

Hi Kev,

I think I've seen you on threads generated by my uncle Frankoo?? Whenever I have deckied for him at Shallow tempest or anywhere out the front of Moreton island it always follows the same pattern. Cast ahead of the direction the boat is drifting. By "cast" I mean as if there was a school of macks in front of the boat and you were flinging the lure as hard as you can, trying to get to them. As the boat drifts toward your line, keep the bail arm open and let as much line as you can freely come off the spool. If your spool is not reasonably full at this stage, the line won't come off freely which means you won't get to the bottom as easily.

The Sea anchor merely helps keep the boat going in the same direction as tide flow, especially if the wind is blowing you in an opposing direction to the current.

That's it! No secrets, you should be doing OK with 1 OZ in 40 - 50 mtrs of water.

Is there anything obvious here that you are not doing?

Scalem

[kingtin]

Hi Kev,

I think I've seen you on threads generated by my uncle Frankoo?? Whenever I have deckied for him at Shallow tempest or anywhere out the front of Moreton island it always follows the same pattern. Cast ahead of the direction the boat is drifting. By "cast" I mean as if there was a school of macks in front of the boat and you were flinging the lure as hard as you can, trying to get to them. As the boat drifts toward your line, keep the bail arm open and let as much line as you can freely come off the spool. If your spool is not reasonably full at this stage, the line won't come off freely which means you won't get to the bottom as easily.

The Sea anchor merely helps keep the boat going in the same direction as tide flow, especially if the wind is blowing you in an opposing direction to the current.

That's it! No secrets, you should be doing OK with 1 OZ in 40 - 50 mtrs of water.

Is there anything obvious here that you are not doing?

Scalem

Duuuuuuuuuh! http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/36/36_20_1.gif Yes, I'm trying it at anchor http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/36/36_20_4.gif

kev

[slyman]

Hey scalem, we've never used our sea anchor, and we mainly fish in depths of less than 10 meters. So if the current is going hard we'll put more weight on, and use the electric motor to help slow us up. We'll then cast in the direction opposite to the current flow, usually at an angle out from the boat, so that the plastic drops with the current and will be on the bottom before it has drawn level with the boat, allowing us to hop it back to the boat.

simon

[Scalem]

Hey scalem, we've never used our sea anchor, and we mainly fish in depths of less than 10 meters. So if the current is going hard we'll put more weight on, and use the electric motor to help slow us up. We'll then cast in the direction opposite to the current flow, usually at an angle out from the boat, so that the plastic drops with the current and will be on the bottom before it has drawn level with the boat, allowing us to hop it back to the boat.

simon

Good one Simon!! You've trumped me! ;D That's even better than a sea anchor having an electric motor ya buggar!- I wish I had one!!;D It always amazes me how many more bream the pro tournament fisho's get for the fact they have a leccie.

Kev - now you have a sporting chance, make sure your leader is flurocarbon to braid tied with a Uni knot http://www.fish4fun.com/Joining2Lines.htm and NO SWIVEL! I use 10lb to 12lb in the bay, Outside I think you might get away with up to 20lb which is still a little light, but still catch snapper. I should do a post and ask the question "How heavy can you go on leader before you notice a decline in number of hits" but generally the lighter the line, the more hits you'll get.. One more thing.... hang on with both hands and don't get caught loafing! Whoohoo!! I can see your post now Kingtin!!:o

Scalem

[PinHead]

my question is: why use braid...why not mono ??
I am sure people caught snapper before braid was introduced.

[Poodroo]

Good one Simon!! You've trumped me! ;D That's even better than a sea anchor having an electric motor ya buggar!- I wish I had one!!;D It always amazes me how many more bream the pro tournament fisho's get for the fact they have a leccie.

Kev - now you have a sporting chance, make sure your leader is flurocarbon to braid tied with a Uni knot http://www.fish4fun.com/Joining2Lines.htm and NO SWIVEL! I use 10lb to 12lb in the bay, Outside I think you might get away with up to 20lb which is still a little light, but still catch snapper. I should do a post and ask the question "How heavy can you go on leader before you notice a decline in number of hits" but generally the lighter the line, the more hits you'll get.. One more thing.... hang on with both hands and don't get caught loafing! Whoohoo!! I can see your post now Kingtin!!:o

Scalem

Could just ask Great_White that question instead. I am sure he will be able to answer that question. ;D

Poodroo

[Scalem]

my question is: why use braid...why not mono ??
I am sure people caught snapper before braid was introduced.

Seems like I've hijacked this thread, appologies for that, but to answer your Q Greg, there's nothing to stop you using Mono for Soft plastics, but here are a few reasons why most of us don't use mono for this type of fishing. The points I am making varies from one brand of mono to another - that's my disclaimer before anyone disagrees with me. I have to generalize to make the following points

Mono stretches more than Braid and therefore you lose the feel of a fish bumping the lure, and also a strike is more exciting to the fisho using braid. Even small fish transmit the energy all the way up the line if its braid.
You should not use swivels when using plastics. Opinions vary but I think a swivel interferes with the action of the plastic. So what happens when you dispense with using a swivel when using Mono? Line twist!! Try using mono, casting repeatedly during the day without a swivel, and you will know what I mean. Again, it varies, and there will be those who would argue their beloved mono they have used for decades won't twist no matter how many times you cast it. FINE! But you will have to pay a fortune for it and there's still the instant "no stretch" benefits to using braid on plastics. I took a surf Alvey 6.5" still loaded with 15KG mono on a bluewater trip with Frankoo. I caught fish on it using SP's but eventually put it away, the line twist was driving me crazy!!
My current braid on the Penn Applause reel has been on it for 2 years and have not had to replace it yet, but ... I will upgrade it just before the R2M. Try get that kind of life out of a $45.00 mono line....I am convinced the Braid lasts much longer than Mono.Hope that answers some questions Greg.

Scalem
,

[slyman]

hey scalem, I think a few of us have hijacked this thread!!;D ;D ::)
sorry to rogersto the original poster! got a bit carried away.

simon

[pennman]

I have never tried the scented gulps or powerbaits. I fish the regular curl tail grubs as the action seems better to me. These type baits have been very good on the type fish I catch here in the states. Maybe the fish are just dumber over here.
One thing I have noticed about fishing SPs in current is it is very important how the plastic is put on the hook. When I am casting across the current I will make sure to put the SP on the hook straight down the center but will spin the SP on the hook so it runs INTO the current slightly so the lure is not just swept away by the tide.

One other tip. With SPs ( unscented) The bite is very subtle. I can't tell you how many people I have fished with that draw a blank when I am catching fish left and right. Most of the time the bite is just a slight tick that others don't notice. But that may just be a local thing.

Doug

[BLOOEY]

Good tip there penman with the rigging of the plastic so it angles toward the current.I personally think gulps are a con.They do not withstand much punishment at all.As for the stink they have you may as well use some dead bait and work it like a lure.CON.

[Davemclean]

erm, I have used rubber baits a couple of times, a couple of things I have found with them are:

1) use an ordinary office hole punch to punch a couple of holes in the tail, this creates a lot of disturbance and streams of bubbles that no self respecting predator can resist

2)if you have two rubber lures of the same size and type, one with a knackered tail, the other with a knackered body, cut the tails off the lures at the same point, and using supergle, fix the decent tail ti the decent body, saves a bit of money and you can tailor the colours of the lure to what you want

[slyman]

I'll have to disagree with you there Blooey, my brother and I use gulps a lot, and I've watched my brother catch fish on HALF a jerkshad, and HALF a shrimp, and HALF a turtleback worm, Not only that, we've used the same jerkshad to catch multiple fish, then put it in a seconds bag if its in good nick, then catch more fish with them the next day or the next week.

[BLOOEY]

Gday slyman.I probably was a little harsh on the gulps there.Just from personal experience they have certainly not been as tough as other softies.And you can catch fish on half a pilly,half a herring and half a mullet.For their price i still think they are a CON.I think we might have to agree to disagree.

[Aquarius]

Rogersto, Soft plastic fishing is all about persistance and patience.
Cheers Brent

[pennman]

Not all SPs are created equal. Some SPs are made of harder tougher plastic.

Aquaris has a very good point about having patience and persistance to learn to be in the right place at the right time. Year after year the target fish seem to school in pretty much the same areas.

An electric trolling motor is ideal for exploring areas and casting the structure. They are also handy for gettin into shallow water. These places are often over looked.

[slyman]

Agreed blooey ;D

simon

[Mullet Musketeer]

Well - I suspect in this argument you are either for or against and there is not much that will change your mind.

I worked them for a couple of months before I became a believer and I think it was three keeper Flathead in 3 casts wading out the front of Nudgee Beach that converted me in April last year.

These are my stats - From April 23rd to December 31, 2006 - 217 keeper fish mainly Flathead, Bream and Cod all on Gulps or Powerbaits. All land-based in either the Brisbane River, Nudgee Beach/Cabbage Tree Creek or the Passage.

The 2 most successful plastics for me are the 2" Gulp Shrimp (Molting) and the 3"Gulp Minnow Grub ( Pumpkinseed).

The trophy fish an 11lb Jew on the 3"Gulp Minnow Grub ( Pumpkinseed) from Boggy Creek.

[DR]

BUT, gulps are not plastics.. they are a plastic shaped synthetic bait..;D

from the horses mouth..
Gulp! is not plastic and is 100% biodegradable. If left in water it will turn into tiny particles within 6-9 months. It's a porous material that sponges up the Gulp scent and disperses through the water at 400 times the rate of any other scented bait. The water flows through the bait because it is porous. With any plastic bait, including PowerBait, the water cannot permeate the plastisol so it can only touch the exterior surfaces of the bait.

One other notable difference between Gulp! and other scented baits is that Gulp! is water based. It moves very well through the water and attaches more easily to the sensor receptors in a fish's smelling and tasting organs.

[mangomick]

Gulps work alright. BCF have caught a lot of blokes with them over the years

[Sean]

I went to the balina fishing park this morning and caught 3 jew up to 5kg on 5 inch jerk shads in gulp

[For Steve]

Since October last year, I've been learning about fishing with plastics. Until recently I had been using only Gulps and Powerbaits. Now I'll have a go with just about anything and they work fine. Some brands work out to be much better value for money than others.

I really only have 2 suggestions:
1. I try to visualise what my plastic is doing during the initial drop and retrieve.
2. Go out with someone who knows what they are doing and learn from them.

Good luck mate.

Regards
Brad

[rogersto]

30 casts into the surf using a nuclear-chicken coloured 2" gulp shrimp produced a 24cm Bream. That lifted my confidence somewhat. Water wasn't particularly clear as the surf was heavy. Wind was offshore, so casting a 1/16 TT jig with #2 hook into the hole wasn't that easy.

This said, every 2nd or 3rd cast with the other rod loaded with a live yabby provides a nibble of some sort, whereas it did take some 30 casts to result in a hit with the gulp.

I could never get a hook'n'land with the pumpinseed gulp mullet, or shaky shad apart from fish chewing the tails off and having toadies molest them at every opportunity, especially in the estuaries.

Looking forward to out for a toss with yellahunter though, I don't mind pumping yabs. but I'm really keen on keeping a 2-piece rod in the boot with some gulps and a change of clothese and when I'm between appointments of have nothing to do in my travels, pull over somewhere and toss a line.... The convenience....

[corby12]

have a look at any of the fishing comps all over the country and see how many people that come in the top 20 used bait. i was the same as you too but for the last 12 months my boat has'nt seen bait. I fish a few comps now and they all use sp's or hard bodie lures. keep trying they are unreal. good luck and dont give up

[BilgeBoy]

Hi Rogerstot

I have been having some success with Lime Tiger in 2" on TT 1/8 jig heads for the bay area. Just slow rod tip lifts...60/40 rule works for me. leave it sit 60% and lift it slow 40%. Leader is critical with SP's. I am currently using Platypus Platinum and having some success. Loop knot so the Jig head swims, cast into the drift and no Bananas on board...all seams to help.

Patience & practice and as I said earlier fish the situation.

Sure is a lot of fun learning. I have seen more sunrises in the last 6 months than I have my whole life!!

Regards

BilgeBoy

[PinHead]

have a look at any of the fishing comps all over the country and see how many people that come in the top 20 used bait. i was the same as you too but for the last 12 months my boat has'nt seen bait. I fish a few comps now and they all use sp's or hard bodie lures. keep trying they are unreal. good luck and dont give up

wouldn't that be due to the rules of the comp..ABT state lure and fly casting only..no mention of bait fishing.

[rogersto]

I must say fishing with SP's is a totally new experience and ball-game going out with someone who's got some experience with using gulps....

Spent 3hrs out with yellahunter last night peppering the Currumbin creek off Throwers Rd bridge from about an hour before the top of the tide to about a couple of hours after. Hardly a hit, zero hook-ups.

Once the flow of water slowed at the top of the tide you could see schools of fish, so they're definetly in there, and the odd fish jumping out of the water every now and then, but despite trying all sorts of retrieve actions, hardly a hit.

I did get a solid hit but no hook-up as Ben was calling it a night, and that prompted me to stay on, did get a nibble, but much to my dismay schools of fish moving around down there but not a hit, whether near the structure (pylons) or out into the middle of the river.

Maybe they just "weren't biting" - Ben was rather surprised at the lack of hits, and from my perspective not having real bait to measure up against, it's a tough call to make a judgement upon. Next time around I will have yabbies with me so it's possible to compare performance between yabs and gulps.

On a positive note, some 30 casts off the tally river breakwall on Saturday morning did land a barely-legal bream on shrimps in the nuclear chicken, using the 9ft rod. On the bridge last night I found the little 7ft stick more comfortable for the flicking action than the bigger stick.

Been keeping the bodies of the gulps that I had recently had tails chewed off en-masse and took them with me on a family trip to Sanctuary Cove. Tossed some bread into the water and within seconds, all sorts of bream just went ballistic over it. Chopped up gulp "mullet" in pumpkin seed and white shaky shad pieces didn't create anywhere near the level of excitement bread rolls did.

As a matter of fact, hardly a fish seemed to express any interest in, most preferring to swim around it, and they were mostly smaller juvenile bream. The bigger ones wouldn't touch it.

This would lead me to believe that some kind of bread product, perhaps a dough, would make good bait for bream.

Anybody got a good dough recipe that attracts bream? Needs to remain reasonably durable in the water rather than disintegrating within minutes... ?

Forgot to mention, funny sight down there, 2 SP's with fireline attached hanging off the powerlines :) Gulps not catching fish but have been known to attract powerlines :o BWWHAHAHAHAHA overzealous casting, and none of them were mine BTW

[slyman]

Hey rogersto, in the latest issue of Modern Fishing June 2007, there is a great article on jigheads. It talks about selecting the best style for your plastics, size to water depth/current recommendations. It also shows a lot of the different brands and styles available on the market and gives tables on available weights and hook sizes.

simon

[yellahunter]

yeah Rog it certainly was a quiet night,
i know ur starting to really doubt the sps but have faith mate, hopefully when the bream finally start to bite this winter you will get a few.

[Sean]

Hi mate, I have a few tips.

Firstly, Bread is an excellent bait for bream. You can fish it 2 ways.
No matter which way, keep any left over bread products in your freezer. When you want to go fishing this is burley only, it will not stay on your hook.

Go to the local bakery and buy the freshest bread...if they are offering a special on yesterdays bread DON'T BE CHEAP! Buy todays. The old stuff doesn't stay on the hook.

1. Anchor up in small creeks next to the bank facing back to a good looking snag. start throwing bits of the bread out so they drift back to the snag....not too many as this will take the fish back past the snag.
With the FRESH bread, rip off a side of crust, and with a really fine guage long shank hook thread it through the hook like you would a fillet....through the top...pull the whole hook through then sort of stitch so the hook shank sits parrallel along the crust. Cast this out unwieghted and the bream smash it off the surface. I'll try to dig out some photos I took of this rig once.

2. If you have an electric, try poppers for bream. Brand isn't too important but river2sea about 50mm long with the feathery stuff on the back hook is a good start...natural colours. Cast these to overhanging branches and twich twitch the lure back to the boat with some long pauses. At least this way you see the fish that follow and get plenty of hits. Cast at shade, High tide in the creeks, and low tide the rock walls....about 5-10 feet deep is pretty good. NO wind on the water surface, if its too rippled up they don't seem to hit. This is my No1 way of catching bream.

3. Any spot that you know holds bream and you can fish this one. Fine guage long shank hook. FRESH bread. Rip the crusts off. With the white bit of the bread rip this in roughly 2 even pieces...2 baits. Don't leave the bread in the sun it will be crap in no time. Lay the hook so you can sort of roll the piece of bread around the hook, sqeeze the crap out of the bread to make it like a cigar shape. It should be about the size of a cigarette but twice as fat with the barb of the hook exposed out the bottom. Now just fish this as you would any other bait, it will stay on the hook,sink and get eaten by Bream. If you wind the bait in you will prob have to change it. If the water is really dirty it won't be as good either. With the burley bread, mix it in a bucket with a bit of water and turn it too paste, not too much water, throw out every now and then. With this, the fish tap tap the bait then leave it for a few secs....usually the next time they grab it they sort of just make off with the bait, let your rod tip go with them for a bit....sort of drop your rod with them then as you feel ready then strike!

Summary: Did i mention FRESH BREAD? DON'T BE CHEAP

All these methods work well for Bream, good luck Sean:)

[Sean]

BTW. Just to give you the shits, I have never really fished a beach b4 but the other day I was down at one of the local ones and I spotted this rip running along the rock wall at the end...I thought...Surely there would have to be Flatties in there. Turns out there was...lots of them. I went down about 1pm today with a 1/6th jig head and 5inch Gulp jerk shad in that silvery colour. First cast, a legal flattie. Second cast nothing, Third cast a better flattie, fourth cast a better flattie again. I ended up with 7 flathead in about 30 mins the best going 70cms. First ever fish off a surf beach Had to leave as I ran out of Jig Heads...the rocks were a bitch. Sean

[Sean]

http://www.ausfish.com.au/vforum/showthread.php?t=91743&page=2&highlight=Sean
This is where I posted these pics, I couldn't view them though, maybe you can. Sean

[GreekBoi]

My older brother use to go out to hastings pont under the bridge and use "gary glitters" and whenever he went out he would always bring home 5x50cm+ flatheads.

I went with him and he said the best way for flatheads is to use gary glitter or black gold in the squidies range and cast out into a hole and retrive it slow.

I caught a 47cm flathead and 38cm flathead with him then, but without him showing me how to catch fish on squidgies i suck.

Like you know the really small jig heads for bream..when I try cast them on my rod they only go 1m away from me or less..buut when I watch starlo and bushy cast it goes atleast 4 - 5 meters on the same tackle.

In a way I just can't wait till I get a boat so I can try them on the reefs.

But I think all in all its practise.. I heard the light resin heads that sorta float on the surface while retriving is awsome for bream.

With all SP its a guessing game on what kind of fish like what color and style.

[theclick]

Like you know the really small jig heads for bream..when I try cast them on my rod they only go 1m away from me or less..buut when I watch starlo and bushy cast it goes atleast 4 - 5 meters on the same tackle.

In a way I just can't wait till I get a boat so I can try them on the reefs.


yeah i struggled with this at first too. I found it has alot to do with your line and also the wrist action. Need really light line, and a real flick, hardly any upper arm movement. I'm pretty good with the 1/8ths now, 1/16s and the ones smaller than that im working on, and thats on an old reel where the drag is either on fully or off fully, and the rod is like a golf flag pole

[imnotoriginal]

Further to what Sean said, I find my hook up rate increased when fishing with bread if I was using braid and left some loose line on the top of the water. I'd then leave the reel in free spool and wait to see the line start going under. When you're happy he's got it in his gob and is running in the opposite direction, close the bail arm and raise the rod. I also found it works better if you don't strike hard, as this tends to pull the hook out of their mouth. Good luck, bread fishing is fun.
Joel